Gambool? Enough FE or just bleh? 50NL

[Kasane]

My very first hand at table. I've got two shortish stacks in with me, so if I'm wrong it's not going to be that painful and great for my image. PF, if I'd noticed quicker that UTG was so short, I don't think I would have called PF -- but I was just opening tables and loading money. Ignorable, but feel free to say "fold pf" if you really need to.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $12.95
<font color="black">Hero (BB): $50.00</font>
UTG: $19.00
MP: $66.20
CO: $35.35
BTN: $74.30

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> Hero is dealt 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (6 Players)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $2.00</font>, MP folds, CO calls $2.00, 2 folds, Hero calls $1.50

<font color="black">Flop:</font> ($6.25) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 Players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, <font color="red">CO bets $6.25</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $25.00</font>,

[Gullanian]

I think it's fine calling 56suited preflop. Reraise maybe a little large? 3x would have the same effect as a 4x.

I might be more comfortable just calling here in any case as the UTG raise could easily signify and overpair and cause result an AI push, especially if UTG is looking at a drawy board like that.

[prodonkey]

playing sc's oop is bad.. playing sc's oop vs short stacks is really bad.

[rappelkastin]

as played i think we pot commited ourself. but yeah i think if we raised to 18 then maybe we could get away from it. But then agian i hate sitting in at a table and then folding my 3bets.... just sets up a weak table image. I think i'd rather raise to 18 and push turn. Set up a wild table image so you can get value from hands later.

Double checking i think ur turn bet puts the short stack all in so yeah fine.

[Chomp]

I'm coming more and more to see poker more as a matter of winning the battle of mistakes than anything else. That's how I'd approach this hand.

The big picture is we have a SC, in a raised pot, OOP, against 2 short stacks, with one player still to act behind us. If we are looking to exploit our edges and make fewer mistakes than our opponants, this is a bad place to start from IMO.

Best case scenario: you fold 2 made hands and pick up a small pot. This is unlikely given CO's bet.

Worst case scenario: you are called ai twice and are in the lap of the gods against 2 made/maybe drawing hands. I;m really not sure the odds/roi are worth it, although I could well be wrong on that technicality.

[creamfillin]

this is a tournament play, eeeck

[corsakh]

[ QUOTE ]
playing sc's oop is bad.. playing sc's oop vs short stacks is really bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

[Isura]

CO will fold here greater than 20% of the time. UTG probably never has a good enough hand to continue unless it is a set

[Kasane]

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, guys, still insisting [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] :
Is there a chance that both of the guys will fold more than 10%?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes -- UTG has nothing. I don't even care if he calls or not. My equity probably won't change much and the pot will be bigger. UTG might've slowplayed AA -- I don't care. He'd be a moron for not C-betting a two tone flop. CO can have anything, and the full pot bet almost argues for a weak hand or draw rather than something stronger.



My god, some of the responses! I love you guys, but think a little. Of course pf is meh and bad -- I stated that in my opening. I'm starting to wonder if anyone actually reads the text or just reads the hand history.

I just didn't notice how short UTG was as it was my first hand of the session. Any more than half a stack and I'll go with it though. As Chomp said, it's a battle of mistakes --BUT WE NEED TO MAKE THE SMALL ONES. Little mistakes are fine and we're doing it all the time, and you should be if you're playing even a little laggy. Post flop you gotta pick it up, and that's where it gets tougher and you have to make more right decisions for bigger money and have you opponents make the big ones while you make the small ones. We make the small mistakes (like folding on the flop when we have the best hand and someone's check-raised us out of the blinds) -- and let our opponents make the big ones (calling down their stack with TP2K when we've got a set on a dry board.)

Now, back to the hand. The shortish stacks for both make my c/r the way to go. A c/c might have some nice implied odds for a straight, but I don't think it's enough with a potential flush draw on some of my "outs"... and I could be facing big bets after I've already lost the hand. I could improve to second best against CO's 60BB stack - my RIO gets bad as I'll have further betting on the next streets. Not so here. No made flush, sets unlikely, made straights unlikely... I'm good against a flush draw with overs as is even if they've got a ton of outs, and fine against any overpair running hot and cold with two cards to come.

Obviously I'm not folding if he pushes. I don't push to psychologically say "we're playing for your stack, but I'm not pushing cause it wouldn't hurt if you called" ... I don't know if it works, but it seems to give me a smidgen more FE and that's all I care about. A flat out push just screams "drawing!!" so I don't.

Right now, with x in the pot, and the most likely call against me a weakish overpair in the 77-TT range -- I've got 40% equity and plenty in the pot to make that EV neutralish. Add a heap of fold equity for when they've got zilch...


I agree with everyone that playing a suited connector OOP is bad, if Heads up against a UTG raise (or from anywhere for that matter, except SB) Add me one caller in-between opener and me, I'm closing action, and I'll call all day long. As long as I happen to notice (wheee!) that opener and caller have some money behind.

Wow, almost a rant -- we now resume your regular programming.

[KEW]

I do not know what the fuss is PF..Closing action vs 2 villains with relative position to the PFer calling here should be standard..

Flop I just CRAI..A CR to 25 leaves villain with only like $8 and the rest is going in on the turn no matter what card falls anyway..I doubt if the added raise effects your FE so you might as well get it in now while you have solid equity vs villain range...