(109 Unarmed) big draw out of BB (10/15)

[tigerite]

PartyPoker, Big Blind is t30 (8 handed) Converter on pregopoker.com

UTG (t945)
UTG+1 (t2830)
MP1 (t495)
MP2 (t950)
CO (t705)
Button (t1070)
SB (t2045)
Hero (t960)

Preflop: Hero is in BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
UTG calls t30, <font color="gray">UTG+1 folds</font>, <font color="gray">MP1 folds</font>, <font color="gray">MP2 folds</font>, <font color="gray">CO folds</font>, <font color="gray">Button folds</font>, SB calls t15, Hero checks

Flop: (t90) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks,

[psyduck]

I would bet 3/4 pot and 3/bet all in to any action.

edit: I thought that 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] was a 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. In this case I'd just call a raise and re-evaluate on the turn.

[raptor517]

lead for 60, call a raise, make a decision on the turn. holla

[tigerite]

I'll post what he actually did in a little while, give people chance to respond [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Paul Thomson]

pysduck and raptor...what is your play if he calls your flop bet and a blank comes on the turn. If we check the turn, I'm sure most villians will bet 3/4 of the pot or so making it very hard for us to call with implied odds. So, I assume that you'll have to lead the turn. I think this could put us in an awkward situation where we're building a large pot out of position with a draw.

What if we check raise the flop and if called then lead the turn. I think we stand a better chance of winning the turn with this line. And if called on the turn and our card hits on the river. It will be disguised well to get paid off.

[Todd]

I dont have a lot of experience with this, but I have started using blocking bets in cases like this (turn misses) to keep them off balance. (this might be transparent in a 109 so your mileage may vary).

In this case the pot would have 270 if both call. So I would bet 120 and see what happens. If a big raise, I go from there. If 2 calls, then reassess after the river falls.

But as you said, if you check you are begging to be bet into, and many villians can make that bet with 72o knowing that you and SB will probably fold.

[Kovner]

I'm the only one that check-calls this flop?

Checking would be the standard play if this were a NL cash game. The idea is that if you check/call, your opponent can't put you on a gutshot. A significant portion of the time, you'll hit your flush draw, make a couple small bets and win a small pot. Some of the time, you'll hit the K on the turn, your opponent will have to put you on a flush draw and will have to be the turn, and when you come over the top he'll be thinking "he really called a PSB with JQ?" and you'll get payed.

You get the value of drawing to the gutshot for the implied odds with the insurance of the flush draw.

If you check, UTG checks and the turn is a blank, fire away. Easy.

Both betting and check-raising are problematic (besides not being able to win a bunch). Betting leaves you with a tought decision OOP on the turn when he calls and the turn blanks. You'll probably check, he'll bet and you'll be faced with a decision that is close to EV neutral.

Check-raising mostly only works if he has a T or a weak A. If he has a strong A like he's supposed to (coming from UTG), he can't lay down on this draw heavy board and a lot of the time you'll be committing a good portion of your chips as a slight dog.

Check-calling wins the most when you hit, loses the least when you don't.

[junkmail3]

[ QUOTE ]

Both betting and check-raising are problematic (besides not being able to win a bunch). Betting leaves you with a tought decision OOP on the turn when he calls and the turn blanks. You'll probably check, he'll bet and you'll be faced with a decision that is close to EV neutral.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, this is a problem playing this hand OOP. If you c/r all in with this big draw, there is a good chance you'll win a tiny pot.

If you miss the turn after you bet, you're either going to make a huge pot with a draw by betting and getting called, or check and get played back at in a manner that could commit you anyway if you decide to call another bet.

I like a check call here. There is no shame in that. If villian is bluffing, you're growing a pot and he may check behind on the turn also.

I'm starting to like the benifits of a check call a lot in this spot.

[tigerite]

Next:

Hero checks, <font color="red">UTG bets t90</font>, <font color="gray">SB folds</font>,

[mike28]

i can't read flops