B&M 3/6 river value bet with set of 3s in huge pot

[mikeca]

This hand came towards the end of a long brutal session. I was card dead for much of the time, and when I got a good hand, they either completely missed the flop or got sucked out on. Standard low limits story. I was down a lot.

I’m in the BB with 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

3 players limp, then an aggressive player raises, one or two players fold, but everyone else calls. SB completes. I figure with this many players in the pot, this is an easy call. UTG now 3 bets (limp – 3bet), and everyone else calls back to me, so I call closing the action.

I think this is all ok with 8 players in the hand. I figure it is flop or set or fold.

Flop, 8 players, 24 SB, Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

With this many players, no way am I slow playing this.

SB checks, I bet, UTG raises, 2 players fold, including the original preflop raiser, but everyone else calls to the SB who now check-3bets. I think for a minute and cap it. Everyone calls.

I think capping it is fine here. I suspected UTG had AA. I’m really not sure what SB has.

Turn, 6 players, 24 BB, [Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

SB checks, I bet, everyone just calls.

River, 6 players, 30 BB [Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Now the straight draws or flushes could have gotten there.

SB bets out, I call (should I have raised?), UTG calls, fold, a really passive woman raises (oops), fold, SB calls, I call

Should I have raised for value on the river? I had been beaten so many times this session by straight and flush draws, I couldn’t bring myself to raise either time on the river with that board.

Results in white:
<font color="white">
UTG had AA
Passive woman had KQo for 2 pair.
SB had K6 clubs - club flush draw on flop, pair of K
My set was good.
</font>

[Bob T.]

[ QUOTE ]
a really passive woman raises (oops), fold, SB calls, I call


[/ QUOTE ]

This was your read. The board was dangerous, and you thought that she was passive. Whether or not it was right, acting on your read is right. I call here, and I am prepared to say NH afterward. When I win, I think it might be time to modify my read of the passive woman to 'passive woman with no idea about hand values.'

[Grease]

I like it. I may C/R the flop and trap everyone and hope to build a monster, especially if you think UTG has an overpair that you just cracked, but I don't mind a lead since it will still build a nice pot.

I like the way you played it. The K is a heinous card for you, but at least it wasn't a club.

[Frond]

Nicely played. I like the whole thing. I think your river play was right on as well after her raise.

[Man of Means]

The correct river play is anything but folding. But I think your seemingly passive play is best: by just calling you are more likely to get calls behind you from a variety of weakish one pair and two pair hands. Whereas raising probably folds out those hands like A3o and exposes you to a 3-bet from only the best.

[AlienBoy]

[ QUOTE ]
Now the straight draws or flushes could have gotten there.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, there were not flush or straight draws ON THE FLOP that got there.

What got there were BACKDOOR draws, and considering the flop was CAPPED, it is unlikely that anyone was chasing either backdoor draw.

i.e. the only thing you are really worried about here is a set larger than yours.


Streets:

PF: Fine, as long as it;s for set value only, and you check/fold the flop with no set.

Flop: fine, though I often just CALL the 3 bet, and then check raise the turn. Or not.

Turn: Yep - if you cap the flop, you *have* to bet out here.

River: call is okay if you are hoping for overcalls - once it is raised though, you might be able to 3 bet it - there's no way passive lady has a backdoor flush - nor a set of kings. She prolly has 2 pair.


AB

[gobbledygeek]

I've noticed two comments regarding "flop a set or fold"; with the pot already at 24 SB before the flop I think this is an easy one bet call on the flop without the set.

[Chino987]

[ QUOTE ]
I've noticed two comments regarding "flop a set or fold"; with the pot already at 24 SB before the flop I think this is an easy one bet call on the flop without the set.

[/ QUOTE ]

closing the action with the 3 of clubs, i peel all day everyday even w/o set in this huge pot.

[ChuckyB]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I've noticed two comments regarding "flop a set or fold"; with the pot already at 24 SB before the flop I think this is an easy one bet call on the flop without the set.

[/ QUOTE ]

closing the action with the 3 of clubs, i peel all day everyday even w/o set in this huge pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a seldom-understood point by most of the people I play B&amp;M 3/6 and 4/8 with.

[James.]

i would consider a raise on the river.

but SB's hand just doesn't add up to much that beats us. that said, this seems like a juicy game. given the multiway situation on the river with a relative scare card(for the field)coming in, going for overcalls seems like a pretty damn good plan. these live games you might get 4 or 5 bets in on the river while only risking one(especially good since we usually must call a 3bet). in this game i would guess people overcall with literally any pair in a pot this size.

raising becomes a better option the more sure you are that you will get coldcalled(or even raised)by worse hands behind you. i've been in some live games like that as well. there have been some 4/8 and 5/10 games at the casino inwhich i could raise that river and have Q5, A2 and 77 pay two bets cold to see a showdown on that same board.