$100NL line check with TT

vetman81 · #1 01-11-2007, 10:57 PM

I am starting to switch from limit to NL, and I had this hand come up, and my friend and I were debating on the turn/river action. Villain was pretty tight in the short time I had been at the table, but in 3 orbits he had raised from the CO twice. Thanks for any comments.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

saw flop|saw showdown

SB ($51)
BB ($57.50)
UTG ($169.70)
UTG+1 ($17.30)
MP1 ($132.25)
MP2 ($138.50)
CO ($98.75)
Hero ($116.15)

Preflop: Hero is Button with T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
4 folds, CO raises to $4, Hero raises to $10, 2 folds, CO calls $6.

Flop: ($21.50) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $11, CO calls $11.

Turn: ($43.50) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
CO checks, Hero checks.

River: ($43.50) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
CO bets $50, Hero calls $50.

Final Pot: $143.50

ChubNub · #2 01-11-2007, 11:17 PM

I think you should raise more preflop, just pot his ass pre. bet more on the flop, maybe about 17-18. On the turn I would bet about 30 and fold to a c/r. However, as played I think you have to call the river.

J0ker · #3 01-11-2007, 11:17 PM

Re-raise more preflop (Around $14). Bet more on the flop (Around $17).

As played, I would call on the river as well and possibly consider raising. Can't see villain having a better pocket pair or quads.

vetman81 · #4 01-11-2007, 11:24 PM

Do you guys think that a turn bet is mandatory, or is checking the turn with the intention of calling a river bet alright? I realize there are quite a few scare cards that could come out on the river, but if he has no hand whatsoever, he is folding the turn. This isnt horrible, as I win the pot, but I dont think that is the best way to maximize my hand. Thoughts?

Thanks for the comments. I agree I should have reraised more PF and bet closer to 3/4 pot on flop.

ChubNub · #5 01-11-2007, 11:32 PM

If he has no hand whatsoever, then he's rarely going to give you any more value on the river. If you're in his spot with 78 on the river and you (as the TT hand) checked behind turn, how often is the 78 you giving any value on the river? If he has something he'd give you value with on the river, he'll probably do the same on the turn.

vetman81 · #6 01-12-2007, 12:08 AM

My thinking at the time was that if he had no hand, then he might try to bluff the river if I checked the turn. If he checks the river, I can put out a bet, and he can fold then too, but it at least gives him the chance to give me more money with no hand.

vetman81 · #7 01-12-2007, 11:51 AM

One bump for other thoughts.

jk3a · #8 01-12-2007, 12:29 PM

I generally bet a little more on the flop, but your line is good. I alternate between betting the turn here and likely checking behind river and your line. NH

vetman81 · #9 01-12-2007, 02:07 PM

A few thoughts about the last few comments: At first I thought raising the river all in is a bad play. Not many hands that call I beat, so I dont think that's a good play. But when I go back and look at the stack sizes, he would only have to call his last $30ish in a $170ish pot, so he probably has to call with 77-99, maybe even as little as AK, so that might have been the best play.

I checked the turn to induce a bluff, so I think I have to call the river. If he checks the turn and river, I dont see how I can not bet the river. I dont think it's really all that thin of a value bet, but I probably wont get called unless hes got something like 55, 77-99 and is just trying to see a showdown. In that case he may call me, but I dont really think he calls me with a high card. I also think that he wouldnt check the turn and river with JJ+, so I can be pretty sure Im ahead. That's my take on it, feel free to tell me where I'm wrong.

beardedwhale · #10 01-12-2007, 02:15 PM

I put him on a PP that is JJ or lower, a pair with either of the two cards on the board, or possibly even just an ace or other overcards. Of those, the only ones that beat you are a 6 or JJ. I think he will probably call with any PP or a pair with one of the board cards, given the bet size he will be calling. He might even call with just an ace. So in my view, a raise is a must and it's not even close. Does anyone view it differently?