Heads up ethics (and other)

[Rekrul]

Rekrul is drunk...if i was sober this post would be much better...but [censored] it no girl tonight so i'm left with two plus two...A bit ago on liquid poker a thread was brought up about one player (original player CASINOCASINO) being on a table and another regular sitting in (who the original regular would never play against because he's scared RASZI) and the original regulars blind got posted without his approval because he was playing too many tables and his table was a fast table.

The original regular stacked the other regular on the first hand(link here: http://www.liquidpoker.net/informati...question..html
)

Long story short: OrigRaiser never would play RegPlayer cuz he feels RegPlayer owns him. But because he unadvertantly got dealt this one hand he felt the right to play it, then he got dealt 10 10(TT) and stacked RegPlayer. RegPlayer is angry and feels he deserves more play time atleast. But OrigPlayer hit and runs instantly.

Other: Regplayer claims that Orig player lied and actually the TT hand was their tenth hand not their first thus voiding orig's claims.

here are my drunken thoughts on the situation:

*****
(PREMIS I AM DRUNK I COULD SHOW U MY FEELINGS MUCH BETTER IF I WAS SOBER..AND MAYBE I WILL SOME DAY)

but reading these insolent posts makes me want to spell it out clearly for you foolish goons

originally i read casinos post and i agreed with him. i agreed with him on the certain situation because heads up is a delicate game and honestly if that was casinos first hand he is obligated to play it because he paid for it and if he won money from it leaving does not make him a hit and run'er

if it was his first hand like he claims: then its okay for him to sit out after that...one time thing no biggy
if it was his 10th hand like razsi claims: eittiquette applies (makes casinocasino a pathetic [censored] and also a compulsive liar for leaving);

ettiquette applies;

if you want people to respect you; when playing someone heads up you will give them the courtesy of time and play them for a while especially if you are up against them...you don't just try to win a pot and leave (casinocasino has doubled up and hitandran many many times...though he also has lost a single buyin and left many times)

in reality, what casinocasino does honestly isn't that unfair. if he loses some money he quits before he tilts....if he wins some money he quits before he loses more ..thats why he does it. to protect himself from his own pathetic personality disorders....casinocasino is not a normal person and he certainly is not a good poker player...he is a pathetic person and normally pathetic people cannot win at poker no matter how smart they are. now not to say casinocasino is that smart but he is of average intelligence and with this strategy and with a little bit of poker skill he can protect himself from his own personality disorders when it comes to making money.

But one of Raszis points (and my own) is that casinocasino has a massive history of hit and running (short buy or full buy)....he does it all the time...yet he posts on forums about his live tourney runs looking for respect from his peers.

(Warning: from this point on im really really drunk and really cannot explain in full.........this is a very sensitive subject and there are much more reasons involved than waht i might type)


WHY:

now...we could say...'who the [censored] cares' seriously...who cares if casinocasino sits down every day at a table heads up and tries to make some money and sit out and save it for next time. if thats his strategy to piss off his opponents into giving him more money next time...so be it? i mean come on...all successful poker players businesses are basically trying to find the best way to take money from their enemy. whos to say which strategy is more ethical than another?....we are in the business of taking peoples money that we dont deserve.

the problem is here: if you wanna be a regular heads up player you need respect from your opponents;

i've seen [censored] like apocolypseplz or skipolo(skipolo not anymore you've learned your lesson and learned manners thank u man ) sit in on my tables when i'm heads up against dead money fish ....then a week later they sit alone on a 25/50 table and not only refuse to play me HU but demand HU when they are vs a fish and if i sit in when they are 2 handed against a fish they say 'HU PLZ'.

this makes them pathetic people among their peers.

in reality and in the real world we are all making (or taking if you might define it) money from people whos money we dont deserve.

be grateful...and be careful...we all are the same...we love to play poker and we love to play it within a controllable means...respect your peers

even though its easy to take a nihilistic approach and try to hit and run and not feel bad....or even though its easy to take an approach where you instantly blame someone for hit and running....

....take a second...look and yourself...look at everyone around you in your community and job...and gain a new respect for yourself.
*****

Discuss the ethics of this situation:

[ahnuld]

gp, but you left out the sensitive part for all us humps.

edit: whoops, you did post a sensitive part. Joey lives!

[ahnuld]

cliff's notes: What goes around comes aroud. If you show no respect people will show you no respect. Lets all show respect as professional players.

[JMa]

"i've seen [censored] like apocolypseplz or skipolo(skipolo not anymore you've learned your lesson and learned manners thank u man ) sit in on my tables when i'm heads up against dead money fish ....then a week later they sit alone on a 25/50 table and not only refuse to play me HU but demand HU when they are vs a fish and i sit in when they are 2 handed against a fish

this makes them pathetic people among their peers."

1000% agree. there is nothing worse than this

[luegofuego]

tauran does that

[eso]

This was no hit n run. He owes nothing. If he'd got stacked himself on that hand, he still would have sat out.
Also, it could have been the end of his session. Why should he be forced to prolong his session when he is feeling fatigued. It is major -ev for him.
And, if he is pressured into carrying on playing this easily, then he may soft play his opponent and let him win a small pot just to appease him. Another -ev move. But his opponent might still not be satisfied, so he would lose another small pot, when will it stop?
Then you have the possibility that he gets lucky again and wins another stack. Now how long must he play for?

Think if a game of double or quits tossing a coin. Only it is biased in your opponents favour, say 40/60. You accidentally participate in a game, and by some good fortune you win. Why should you play again when you are at a disadvantage. Also, if you do play a 2nd time to appease your opponent, what happens if you win this time too? How many more games should you play? Everyone will agree that playing until you go broke is a stupid idea!

[jcmoussa]

I didnt bother reading most of your post rekrul, but [censored] people who ask to play Hu against a fish. Traheho threatened to gut me and said all this other [censored] up [censored] this week because i wouldnt let him play dracospinner HU because there were only two tables going on at this time of day.

[Rekrul]

If both people on the table don't specifically say they want heads up then you are perfectly within your rights and your ethical values to sit in.....the only time you might consider not sitting in in this situation is when the player you're talking to is down a lot. But the whole point is...HU is not black and white...there is a [censored] load of grey area and if any of you people lack the competency to comprehence which area is which color you better stay on the [censored] internet.

Soon I'm coming out with a list of top 10 internet [censored] poker players and Ozzy87 is gunna be near the top for this very reason (fat girls being #2 reason).

[FoxwoodsFiend]

[ QUOTE ]
If both people on the table don't specifically say they want heads up then you are perfectly within your rights and your ethical values to sit in.

[/ QUOTE ]

I never understood why it's considered so messed up to not accetp somebody's request to let them play a fish HU. This is, IMO, just people wanting to monopolize the chance at a fish's money and making it seem like there's some sort of ethical premise behind it: as long as you're consistent and don't try keeping your games HU when others sit in, it's still "within your rights" to interrupt a HU game. Sucks for the guy trying to keep the game HU, but you don't owe him anything.

Also, casinocasino owes Razi no additional hands if Razi snuck into the game and it backfired: if it is their 10th hand as Razi claims then obviously it's a different story.

[fsuplayer]

wait, were u drunk when u wrote this?