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#1
11-27-2006, 06:52 PM
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Amount for a verbal raise in NL
I believe that this may have been discussed long ago, and there probably would have been a disagreement, but I can't find any posts about it.
This has come up a few times recently for me in live play and not always settled the same. I'm quite curious about what the actual ruling should be. Player A makes a bet, lets say $55. Player B says "$100". It's that simple - what is the ruling on Player B's 'raise'? 
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#2
11-27-2006, 06:59 PM
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Re: Amount for a verbal raise in NL
Usually, he is immediately by the dealer told that he needs to make it $110 (a full raise), to which the player follow suit with no problem, and it is no big deal. This happens all the time in NL cash games that I have been in, and it has never been a problem. Usually, it is just a simple error on Player Bs part, and is easily correctable with no need for floor involvement.
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#3
11-27-2006, 09:59 PM
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Re: Amount for a verbal raise in NL
[ QUOTE ]
Usually, he is immediately by the dealer told that he needs to make it $110 (a full raise), to which the player follow suit with no problem, and it is no big deal. This happens all the time in NL cash games that I have been in, and it has never been a problem. Usually, it is just a simple error on Player Bs part, and is easily correctable with no need for floor involvement. [/ QUOTE ] Agree. One place it is different is Hawaiian Gardens, where any short raise is corrected to a call (if there is floor involvement, and the floor knows the rules). They also require that the minimum raise be twice the amount of the total bet you are facing, rather than twice the last raise. ~ Rick
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#4
11-27-2006, 07:00 PM
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Re: Amount for a verbal raise in NL
[ QUOTE ]
I believe that this may have been discussed long ago, and there probably would have been a disagreement, but I can't find any posts about it. This has come up a few times recently for me in live play and not always settled the same. I'm quite curious about what the actual ruling should be. Player A makes a bet, lets say $55. Player B says "$100". It's that simple - what is the ruling on Player B's 'raise'? [/ QUOTE ] It depends. Most commonlly it would be a raise to $110. A few palces it would be a call only. In a heads up situation it should be a raise to $100 (I wouldn't really count on getting that ruling).
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#5
12-02-2006, 12:16 AM
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Re: Amount for a verbal raise in NL
[ QUOTE ]
In a heads up situation it should be a raise to $100 (I wouldn't really count on getting that ruling). [/ QUOTE ] Randy - I'm curious why this should only be a raise to $100 heads up....is that an old school thing?
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#6
12-02-2006, 12:22 AM
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Re: Amount for a verbal raise in NL
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] In a heads up situation it should be a raise to $100 (I wouldn't really count on getting that ruling). [/ QUOTE ] Randy - I'm curious why this should only be a raise to $100 heads up....is that an old school thing? [/ QUOTE ] Yes most rule books I have looked at closely specifically say that the rule about the raise being at least the size of the bet does not apply heads up.
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#7
12-03-2006, 10:58 PM
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Re: Amount for a verbal raise in NL
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] In a heads up situation it should be a raise to $100 (I wouldn't really count on getting that ruling). [/ QUOTE ] Randy - I'm curious why this should only be a raise to $100 heads up....is that an old school thing? [/ QUOTE ] Yes most rule books I have looked at closely specifically say that the rule about the raise being at least the size of the bet does not apply heads up. [/ QUOTE ] Makes sense. There is no worry of slowly whipping a third player out of all his chips when you are heads up.
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#8
12-04-2006, 05:52 PM
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Re: Amount for a verbal raise in NL
The way this is ruled depends on how it plays out.
1) Player A makes a bet, lets say $55. Player B says "$100". What is the ruling on Player B's 'raise'? Ruling: Dealer should immediatly correct player b and let him know that he did not make a proper raise. Why? No chips were placed into play. He only made a verbal declaration of $100. That means nothing. The only verbal declarations that have any meaning at this point are: Fold, Raise, Call, $55, $110, or an amount of money greater than $110. 2) Player A makes a bet, lets say $55. Player B says '$100' and throws $100 into the pot.. What is the ruling on Player B's 'raise'? Ruling: Player B is held to a call. Why: Player B made a verbal declaration that had no meaning because $100 is not a valid raise. He then threw $100 into the pot (no matter what denominations were used). That $100 is not enough to make it a valid raise, therefore, he is held to a call. 3) Player A makes a bet, lets say $55. Player B says 'Raise to$100' or 'raise... make it $100' and either does or does not throw $100 into the pot.. What is the ruling on Player B's 'raise'? Rule: Player B is held to a minimum raise. Why: He verbalized his intentions to raise by saying 'RAISE'. He did not make his raise big enough to be a valid raise, therefore he is held to the minimum raise of $55 more. Upon correction, I would also not allow him to make his corrected raise any higher than the minimum raise. 4) Player A makes a bet, lets say $55. Player B says 'make it $100' and throws $100 into the pot.. What is the ruling on Player B's 'raise'? Ruling: Player B is held to a call. Why: 'Make it' is not a valid verbal declaration that indicates a raise. $100 is not a valid raise. "Make It" - Although most people understand that the player says "Make It" if they are going to raise... but this is not a valid verbal declaration by itself. Why: If "Make it" is used interchangably with 'raise', then where do we stop? Change it to $100, Increase it to $100, Get Bigger $100, Raise the roof, juice it up, turn it up, up the volume, give the thumbs up, pusing your hands to the sky, nodding your head in the general direction of the ceiling. How do you decide what phrases or motions hold you to a raise? By limiting it to one. Raise.
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#10
11-27-2006, 08:58 PM
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Re: Amount for a verbal raise in NL
doesnt it depend on wether this was preflop or post flop?
If you are playing 2/5NL and it's PF, then player B must reraise to a minimum of 105 since the increment of Player A's raise was 50 more than the Big Blind. Therefore, Player B must double the increment of the previous bet. Post flop: If Player A is first to bet 55, then Player B must reraise to a minimum of 110.
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