Multiple vexers for me

kiemo · #1 10-05-2006, 08:54 PM

Both these hands happened in my first 15 hands on the table and both had me twisted on what to do.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. MP3 posts a blind of $1. CO posts a blind of $1.
2 folds, Hero calls, MP1 raises, 4 folds, SB calls, 1 fold, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP1 bets, SB folds, Hero raises, MP1 calls.

Turn: (6.50 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets, Hero calls.

River: (8.50 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 10.50 BB

I can here the gallery shouting raise preflop, but I dont think thats the best play with these type of hands in ep.
Also given the tightness of the Party tables right now, I dont lead the turn here becuase I am pretty much behind everything that I think he would raise preflop and would call my flop check raise.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is CO with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
6 folds, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, 1 fold.

Flop: (5 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, SB calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

River: (6.50 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.50 BB

No clue where to go on this hand. His turn donk has me thinking hes got the queen here.

knockonwood · #2 10-05-2006, 09:09 PM

Hand 1 - fold PF. Fold Flop. Fold turn (small pot)

Hand 2 - Raise the turn

btspider · #3 10-05-2006, 10:33 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1 - fold PF. Fold Flop. Fold turn (small pot)

[/ QUOTE ]

small pot? check-folding the flop is very very bad. PF is fine too.

the first thought should be to check-call x3 and showdown.. then see if there's a better line.

in hand 2:
i'd prob just call the flop to let him keep bluffing or save $$ when behind.

knockonwood · #4 10-05-2006, 10:43 PM

I don't like limping QTs UTG. IMO, checking is the right decision because you have a PFR who will raise a donk bet.

I think if you want to protect the hand, a c/r would work better. Either way, I'm sticking to c/f as the PFR has too big a range to have us way behind or dominated.

btspider · #5 10-05-2006, 10:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like limping QTs UTG. IMO, checking is the right decision because you have a PFR who will raise a donk bet.

I think if you want to protect the hand, a c/r would work better. Either way, I'm sticking to c/f as the PFR has too big a range to have us way behind or dominated.

[/ QUOTE ]

what range are you giving him? i cannot even fathom a flop c/f here.

knockonwood · #6 10-05-2006, 10:51 PM

Its kind of like a semi-bluff donk, if that makes sense. If I get called or raised, i'm out of the hand.

Bruce D · #7 10-05-2006, 09:27 PM

In the first hand, it looks like the villian hit his draw, or is betting his flush draw that just came in, but more likely the former. A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Jx could play like this. His flop bet was more likely a c-bet than a bet for value. His turn bet could be that he doesn't want it checked behind now because he has just made his hand.

With all that being said, lately it seems I have been watching the donkeys bet underpairs to scary boards. I have been more inclined to pay them off it they hit. His bet on the river makes me think he has a made hand. The underpairs rarely bet the river. I pay the river and cry.

The second board I raise the turn and fold to a 3 bet. There is no reason for the villian to think you will check this behind. If he thinks he has the better hand, he would 90% of the time check raise this if he has the balls for it.

In my opinion, this bet on the turn is weak pot steal attempt. I raise for value.

I hate the river card. I call and probably pay off the donkeys flush. I then curse and make some notes.

kiemo · #8 10-05-2006, 10:26 PM

You guys forget to take into account that I am doomswitched on Party. And I honestly believe this after once again starting off good when playing a bonus but getting sucked out time and time again, making second bests constantly, and missing every single draw, the closer the bonus comes to clearing.

Seriously - hitting less then 10% of your 4 flush and OESD draws over a sample size of 5k+ is just wrong!

knockonwood · #9 10-05-2006, 10:29 PM

Least Party are finally going to go busto, or towards busto...

nofutures · #10 10-06-2006, 07:16 AM

*grunch*
First hand I would preflop and on the turn or lead the turn and fold UI.

On the turn in the second hand it seems like a bet/fold situation to me.