Advice on these 3b pots

[markuisis]

Villain is same in both hands and is def a light 3 bettor, I dont wanna 4bet tens and turn them into a bluff and I felt as though if I 4bet 46s after all his 3bets it would be too transparent. It seems like I keep getting pushed out of these 3b pots - what do u guys do differently in these spots? thx

Full Tilt Poker, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

SB: $143.15
BB: $173.70
UTG: $100
MP: $159.20
CO: $125.40
Hero (BTN): $99.50

Pre-Flop: 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BTN)
3 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $3.50</font>, <font color="red">SB raises to $13.50</font>, BB folds, Hero calls $10

Flop: ($28) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $18</font>, Hero calls $18

Turn: ($64) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $64</font>, Hero folds

Results: $64 Pot ($3 Rake)
SB mucked and WON $61 (+$29.50 NET)


Full Tilt Poker, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

SB: $131.65
BB: $156.20
UTG: $99.50
MP: $152.60
CO: $94.40
Hero (BTN): $107.60

Pre-Flop: T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BTN)
3 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $3.50</font>, <font color="red">SB raises to $13.50</font>, BB folds, Hero calls $10

Flop: ($28) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $18</font>, Hero calls $18

Turn: ($64) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $38</font>, Hero folds

Results: $64 Pot ($3 Rake)
SB mucked and WON $61 (+$29.50 NET)

[markuisis]

another which is similar to earlier 1 but a different villain, just feels like im getting pushed around:
Full Tilt Poker, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

MP: $66.55
Hero (CO): $289.95
BTN: $127.95
SB: $99
BB: $86
UTG: $125.05

Pre-Flop: 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (CO)
2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $3.50</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">SB raises to $12</font>, BB folds, Hero calls $8.50

Flop: ($25) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $15</font>, Hero calls $15

Turn: ($55) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($55) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $35</font>, Hero folds

Results: $55 Pot ($2.75 Rake)
SB mucked and WON $52.25 (+$25.25 NET)

[thac]

[ QUOTE ]
another which is similar to earlier 1 but a different villain, just feels like im getting pushed around:
Full Tilt Poker, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

MP: $66.55
Hero (CO): $289.95
BTN: $127.95
SB: $99
BB: $86
UTG: $125.05

Pre-Flop: 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (CO)
2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $3.50</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">SB raises to $12</font>, BB folds, Hero calls $8.50

Flop: ($25) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $15</font>, Hero calls $15

Turn: ($55) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($55) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $35</font>, Hero folds

Results: $55 Pot ($2.75 Rake)
SB mucked and WON $52.25 (+$25.25 NET)

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, just fold. Who cares.

[markuisis]

The reason I call pf isnt to bust his big hand (which he obviously doesnt necessarily have) - its to pull moves on his wide range on favourable flops, hitting a good disguised hand doesnt hurt either. Both these hands I have sd value though so I didnt c y I would raise - do some of u really fold a pair to sum1 who is auto c-betting any flop?

[thac]

[ QUOTE ]
The reason I call pf isnt to bust his big hand (which he obviously doesnt necessarily have) - its to pull moves on his wide range on favourable flops, hitting a good disguised hand doesnt hurt either. Both these hands I have sd value though so I didnt c y I would raise - do some of u really fold a pair to sum1 who is auto c-betting any flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

'pulling moves' should be more than calling one street and folding the next. You have like barely any showdown value.

[markuisis]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The reason I call pf isnt to bust his big hand (which he obviously doesnt necessarily have) - its to pull moves on his wide range on favourable flops, hitting a good disguised hand doesnt hurt either. Both these hands I have sd value though so I didnt c y I would raise - do some of u really fold a pair to sum1 who is auto c-betting any flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

'pulling moves' should be more than calling one street and folding the next. You have like barely any showdown value.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have sd value against the entire part of his range that missed the flop (id only call if that seems like the majority of his range), and I like to pull moves when I dont have this sd value. This might be wrong though and these spots seem like a big leak of mine.

[spivey]

Yeah, 3 bet pots are getting out of hand. These are all folds pf.

[spivey]

With 100bb effective, there's just not enough maneuvering room to make moves postflop without a read.

[markuisis]

Also, if I don't call with these non-dominated hands - what do u guys advocate calling light 3bets with? I just felt like a 4bet bluff in the first 1 would be transparent given how the game had gone.

[bi11 frist]

[ QUOTE ]
With 100bb effective, there's just not enough maneuvering room to make moves postflop without a read.

[/ QUOTE ]

agreed, watch the guy play in a couple 3b pots, get a handle on what he's doing, then start making the moves. doing this without postflop reads is burning money.