I suck at blind steals

CrMenace · #1 07-25-2007, 06:51 PM

Villain is 12/10/3, folds BB to steal 50%. Stats were the reason I went for a steal.

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
7 folds, Hero raises, 1 fold, BB 3-bets, Hero calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero...

Assume flop didn't help villain, but do you assume a 3b PF has you beat anyways?

BigBadBabar · #2 07-25-2007, 07:01 PM

12/10, wow

folding now can't be bad

00Snitch · #3 07-25-2007, 07:16 PM

I fold it and continue to suck at steals too. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

JamesBJames · #4 07-25-2007, 07:45 PM

I'd fold too. The BB seems to be an extremely tight player who probably plays mainly 'premium' hands (12/10!?). There's not much he would 3-bet preflop that we're actually beating now.

Also, if we're behind on the flop, we're not drawing to many outs since there are two spades on the board along with the threat of possible reverse domination. Calling is obviously wrong. Not too sure about raising, although, I'd imagine that we get 3-bet more often than not with this guy.

Harv72b · #5 07-25-2007, 07:43 PM

I assume a 3b PF by this guy has me crushed.

As far as the more general question, say that instead of 12/10/3 the BB is 25/14/2, and you've seen evidence that he steals & resteals very aggressively. Against a player like that I'm almost always calling the flop bet, and then re-evaluating on the turn...if I improve on the turn then I'm seeing a showdown, if I don't then I sort of play it by ear, sometimes folding & sometimes calling. Note that I consider the board double-pairing to be an improvement for my hand.

If I call a turn bet (and I'm probably not raising the turn no matter what it is, except possibly as a bluff), then I am always calling a river bet as well. By that point the pot will be laying us around 7:1, and if we're going on the premise that we started with the best hand a decent percentage of the time & that we're chopping a fair percentage of the rest, that's good enough.

Incidentally, when it's folded around to you on the Button & you see A8o, you should be raising every time. That's a very good starting hand when all you have to worry about are the blinds, and is well ahead of the two random hands they'll be holding. Against a BB with stats like those, you can really consider openraising with any two cards (especially if the SB is also tight).

HouseCalls · #6 07-25-2007, 07:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Assume flop didn't help villain, but do you assume a 3b PF has you beat anyways?

[/ QUOTE ]

Not against an average opponent but against a rock like this I don't think I could fold fast enough.

Zeldark · #7 07-25-2007, 07:57 PM

So the moral of the story is that reads are reary helpful in blind steal situations? I just don't know!

JohnEPark · #8 07-25-2007, 09:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]

So the moral of the story is that reads are reary helpful in blind steal situations? I just don't know!

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the moral of the story is you tried to steal from someone who is more than capable of laying down their big blind, but happened to wake up with a hand this time.

Zeldark · #9 07-25-2007, 09:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

So the moral of the story is that reads are reary helpful in blind steal situations? I just don't know!

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the moral of the story is you tried to steal from someone who is more than capable of laying down their big blind, but happened to wake up with a hand this time.

[/ QUOTE ]
Maybe. Maybe not. Considering I wasn't even in the hand, I'm going to lean towards not.

JohnEPark · #10 07-25-2007, 09:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe. Maybe not. Considering I wasn't even in the hand, I'm going to lean towards not.

[/ QUOTE ]

for some reason i thought you were OP, my mistake.