Keep aces or draw? (MTT 5CD on Stars)

THEjDonk · #1 02-06-2007, 10:51 AM

I just played my first limit draw tourney on Pokerstars. The tables were 6-handed. 48 participants, I finished 11th.

In one hand I had AA235, one card to a flush. I raised from 1st position, and everyone(!) called me. I decided that I probably needed to improve my hand to win the pot. I discarded an ace. Is this a good or bad move? Maybe I'll win with aces-up or even one pair. What do you think I should have done?

Edit: If you didn't notice, I'm drawing to a gutshot straight flush.

THEjDonk · #2 02-06-2007, 11:32 AM

BTW: This is a $5-touney. Some of the players at the table seems to be playing too loose. Guess there's a couple of donkeys there. (hope I'm not one of them) [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

flafishy · #3 02-06-2007, 11:42 AM

That's a close call. But I think I would hold the aces because there's a decent chance they would be good even unimproved. Your odds of improving to two pairs are a bit better than connecting on your come draw. If you miss drawing to AA, you still could win a decent pot. If you miss drawing to the come, you have no chance.

Tom Bayes · #4 02-06-2007, 11:45 AM

I'd keep my aces. You are going to have a slightly better chance of improving to aces-up/trips/better as you are drawing to the gutshot straight flush and when you keep your aces you'll have a hand with showdown value in case you miss. Unimproved aces will win more than you think against loose-passive donkeys. Don't be shocked if the entire table called with smaller pairs and crappy draws.

I'm more inclined to break a pair to draw when my pair is lower than aces and especially if someone else has 3-bet and is truly representing a hand that can beat mine.

THEjDonk · #5 02-06-2007, 01:19 PM

Thanks for the replies. I was very unsure about what to do. I probably chose to draw one because that would make my postdraw-decisions easier.

I did pretty well for the first hour. I was chipleader when half the players were gone, but then I didn't get into any favorable situations once the blinds started to get big.

I think I only made two really big mistakes. I once called a button-raise from BB with a pair that was quite a bit too small. The other mistake was calling a reraise with only jacks-up. I had raised from early position, but the reraiser probably has trips or better almost always. He actually had a pat hand this time. I got to see his 5-high straight because a short-stacked player had called all-in from 1st position predraw.

Next time I play, I'll try to make sure that I don't call raises when I know I don't have the odds. I should probably bluff more often too. I only considered it twice, and both times I thought "What's the point? These donkeys will call anyway." That might not be entirely true, especially in the latter stages.

Al Mirpuri · #6 02-06-2007, 09:00 PM

I draw, when you hit the straight flush you can break people and the ace high flush will break people though you would have to play it less strong. As for keeping the Aces, seventy percent of the time you do not improve but one of those five does...

Big Limpin · #7 02-07-2007, 02:31 PM

i'm with mr mirpuri on this one. draw to the s/f, as it plays itself post-draw. you either have a great hand, or nothing, and against 5 villains, i think thats what you need. a hand built for breaking people, or else folding for no further loss.

it will be no fun when you have to act first after drawing to AA, you now have AA55...maybe you bet and get raised...now what?

THEjDonk · #8 02-08-2007, 07:24 AM

Oh. It's your birthday? congratulations [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

Big Limpin · #9 02-08-2007, 07:50 AM

im sorry, i thought this was a pot limit hand. my bad. my last post should be deleted. you'll gain alot less when hitting s/f draws.

in limit, sticking with AA seems better. i'd agree then with Bayes & flafishy that the showdown value of guaranteed top pair can't be thrown away. 6 big bets already in the pot [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] soyou really want something to showdown this pot.

[img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] woot, birthday! [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

Al Mirpuri · #10 02-08-2007, 12:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
im sorry, i thought this was a pot limit hand. my bad. my last post should be deleted. you'll gain alot less when hitting s/f draws.

in limit, sticking with AA seems better. i'd agree then with Bayes & flafishy that the showdown value of guaranteed top pair can't be thrown away. 6 big bets already in the pot [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] soyou really want something to showdown this pot.

[img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] woot, birthday! [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I made same error and I made it first. I still do not see your aces which do not improve seventy percent of the time holding up. You have to draw. It is nowhere near as attractive a draw as it would be in a pot limit tournament but it is still the best play even at limit.