tips for getting full-time offer on Wall St.

[higher_energy]

I guess I will get straight to the point. I want to get a full time offer on Wall St. after I graduate in one of the top ibanks at the desk. I know what it takes and I am willing to work as hard as necessary because I want this job. Obviously, there are a few problems, at least the way I see it:

1) I go to a good school but its not in the top 10 core schools from which these companies recruit.
2) I do well in school but I do not have a 3.7 mainly because I have been on the rowing team throughout all of college which was a huge commitment. It’s my senior year and after a lot of though I quit this season.
3) I interned in a foreign ibank this summer.

Basically, my main concern is surviving the resume scan which is very tough. Should I put poker among interests? How can I stand out among all the 4.0 candidates from Harvard who’s older brother is a senior analyst at Bear or JP?

I am fairly confident that I can get it if I get a chance to interview.

There is a number of people here with experience in trading so if anybody has any tips or insider advice that is not covered in any of the presentations, books, career offices and online, please let me know. I really appreciate all the help…Thanks a lot.

[gimpoone]

Some answers to your questions:

1. What school exactly do you go to? Most places actually don't really care about the school you go to, they just frequent the ivy leagues, because any idiot knows, the 'smarter' crowd is there.
2. What's your GPA? You saying you don't have a 3.7 means diddly, is it more like a 2.7? Rowing team is good, they like candidates that compete in sports.
3. So what, you interned just like 90% of the candidates, won't hurt, but won't help much.

How I got into the industry...you are right, they will probably throw your resume away unless it says Harvard/Yale, etc. Seeing as you don't go there, I'd suggest you network with someone in the company that went to your school. Drop him an email and say what's up...I went to XXXX school just like you, wondering if you wanted to meet up for lunch to chat about how I can break into the XXXX field you want to get in on Wall Street. Turns out the first trading firm I worked at, the President was an alma mater at my school, so I got to bypass all the crap interviews, interviewed with him and the CEO and the rest was said and done, hired.

Tell them you play poker and blackjack, I remember when I was talking to some Susquehanna reps at a job fair, one of the hot chicks asked me if I played blackjack...I was totally caught off guard and I said yeah, I play blackjack every so often when I go to Atlantic City and Vegas. That's all she asked and took my resume. Couple days later, I get a call for first interview...don't know if it was the blackjack answer, but I figure if they ask, it must be somewhat 'important'. Visit www.thevault.com, good site for this kind of stuff.

[Evan]

[ QUOTE ]

Tell them you play poker and blackjack, I remember when I was talking to some Susquehanna reps at a job fair, one of the hot chicks asked me if I played blackjack...I was totally caught off guard and I said yeah, I play blackjack every so often when I go to Atlantic City and Vegas. That's all she asked and took my resume. Couple days later, I get a call for first interview...don't know if it was the blackjack answer, but I figure if they ask, it must be somewhat 'important'.

[/ QUOTE ]
You'd be a fool NOT to follow this advice.

[starbird]

[ QUOTE ]
Tell them you play poker and blackjack, I remember when I was talking to some Susquehanna reps at a job fair, one of the hot chicks asked me if I played blackjack...

[/ QUOTE ]

Susquehanna in particular is known for wanting to hire games players. Poker or blackjack would be a strong plus with them.

[higher_energy]

Thanks a lot for all the insight. I was away for a while, had a ton of work and didn't really have time to check 2p2.

To answer some of the questions: I go to Tufts and I have a 3.36. I was a mess freshman year, took way too many hard classes for a freshman, joined the varsity team, slept during the day and worked at night and have been raising my GPA ever since.
I agree with what a lot of you are saying about the importance of networking, interviewing skills and being a good fit for the firm. Ultimatly, they will hire the guy with whom they can get a drink after work. While all of this is true I feel like the hardest is to be able to GET that 1st round interview, at least for me.
For the past two and a halfs weeks I have been scouring Boston and NYC for anyone that can be of any help. My parents don't have any contacts at all in the finance world because I am not from the U.S.
In any case, I have been to pretty much every presentation/conference/networking panel at Harvard, MIT and of course at my school (can't make them all because of classes). After being stared up and down by all the harvard kids and sending over 40 thank you notes I feel like I haven't made that much progress.
I am pushing very hard throuhg all the Tufts alums and the career network at my school, but the problem here is that they are taking at most 1-2 kids for each firm and I am competing against some of the very best with MUCH higher point averages.
What else do you think I should be doing to increase my chances of getting a full-time position?
Also, up to a few weeks ago I was certain that I want to do S&T but now, after reading more resources and talking to analysts, I am also interested in IBD because I feel like I can develop a broader skill set which will be more transferable in the future and i can get exposure to deal flow. While I am still young I am OK with working insane hours so that doesn't bother me at all about IBD. I know that these are completely different areas, require different skill sets and personality types. My question is this: If i apply for both at one firm do you think that will jeopardize my chances for getting either one of them? Same goes for applying to other departametns like GTS, CM etc? You think i should just focus on one thing or go for whatever I can get?

Last point that I wanted to make. In response to gimpoone, I wanted to say that I DID NOT intern at Wall St. this summer. Instead I interned in Moscow at the leading Russian Ibanks (had to get a visa so had to come back). It was just as intense, but I feel like thats a disadvantage relative to other candidates.


To whoever made it to the end of this post..thanks a lot and I appreciate any comments, tips or advice.

higher_energy

[NajdorfDefense]

[ QUOTE ]
To answer some of the questions: I go to Tufts and I have a 3.36. I was a mess freshman year, took way too many hard classes for a freshman, joined the varsity team, slept during the day and worked at night and have been raising my GPA ever since.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not a problem you just gotta tell that story well.

[ QUOTE ]
After being stared up and down by all the harvard kids and sending over 40 thank you notes I feel like I haven't made that much progress.

[/ QUOTE ]

Life is like that. Persistence + Sincerity + Discipline = eventual Reward.
[ QUOTE ]

Also, up to a few weeks ago I was certain that I want to do S&T but now, after reading more resources and talking to analysts, I am also interested in IBD because I feel like I can develop a broader skill set which will be more transferable in the future and i can get exposure to deal flow. While I am still young I am OK with working insane hours so that doesn't bother me at all about IBD. I know that these are completely different areas, require different skill sets and personality types. My question is this: If i apply for both at one firm do you think that will jeopardize my chances for getting either one of them?

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course not.

[ QUOTE ]
Same goes for applying to other departametns like GTS, CM etc? You think i should just focus on one thing or go for whatever I can get?


[/ QUOTE ]

If you really want a job in a certain area - you MUST focus on that area - networking, interviewing, resume, thank-yous, info sessions, leverage the Tufts office to give you anyone's name in the industry and start writing them. Squeaky wheel, etc.

[ QUOTE ]
Last point that I wanted to make. In response to gimpoone, I wanted to say that I DID NOT intern at Wall St. this summer. Instead I interned in Moscow at the leading Russian Ibanks (had to get a visa so had to come back). It was just as intense, but I feel like thats a disadvantage relative to other candidates.

[/ QUOTE ]

Totally disagree - that is an advantage, I can't even see someone else in HR not thinking so, although they may certainly press you on it to ensure you were doing 'real' work.

At the end of the day, you get lucky/network your way into the first round interviews. From there, it's all in how you perform in that 30 minutes. You must be able to sell yourself, period. Dress smart, read up on *anything and everything* having to do with markets, wall st, deal flow, energy mkts, et al. NEVER be late, shoes polished, nice tie, make polite conversation with the ass'ts/receptionists, immediate thank-you notes, perfectly formatted resume, etc.

I graduated a semester early, so it was easier for me to get interviews/meet with people, just happened to work out better for me because there were much fewer candidates finishing up during fall than spring.

[NajdorfDefense]

[ QUOTE ]
I want to get a full time offer on Wall St. after I graduate in one of the top ibanks at the desk. I know what it takes

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, obviously not. I'm sure you see why.

[ QUOTE ]
and I am willing to work as hard as necessary because I want this job.

[/ QUOTE ]

Easy to say, harder to do, much harder to prove. Are you up for 3 consecutive 110 hour weeks? Are you up for 3 days and 2 nites str8 working on the same pitch, leaving to shower and change only, and then flying down to ATL yourself to deliver by noon, after finishing the books at 7 am?

Are you really? Think hard. Because I've yet to meet the I-banking analyst who does, and I've worked with and met several hundred of them.
Okay, maybe 2 or 3 of them were so lifeless and dull they didn't mind having no life, like, ever. Maybe 3 of them.

[ QUOTE ]

1) I go to a good school but its not in the top 10 core schools from which these companies recruit.
2) I do well in school but I do not have a 3.7 mainly because I have been on the rowing team throughout all of college which was a huge commitment. It’s my senior year and after a lot of though I quit this season.
3) I interned in a foreign ibank this summer.


[/ QUOTE ]

Irrelevant x3.
I had a 3.3 and bagged the best Ibank in the known Universe out of undergrad. No one cares about your GPA. No one cared when I went to IBank 2, and then to IBank #3. Never came up. [Obvs by then work experience counted more, but still.]
I talked more about craps in 90% of my interviews, or basketball than anything else.

[ QUOTE ]
Basically, my main concern is surviving the resume scan which is very tough. Should I put poker among interests? How can I stand out among all the 4.0 candidates from Harvard who’s older brother is a senior analyst at Bear or JP?

[/ QUOTE ]

1) You will NOT get a job with your resume, pretty much ever.
2) Listing Poker/bj/ and/or craps is a must-do.
3) It's all about the networking.


[ QUOTE ]

There is a number of people here with experience in trading so if anybody has any tips or insider advice that is not covered in any of the presentations, books, career offices and online, please let me know.

[/ QUOTE ]

Trading is not I-banking, this post now makes no sense to me. Which do you want?

[Evan]

[ QUOTE ]
the best Ibank in the known Universe

[/ QUOTE ]
Don't be bashful, tell us who this is.

[BDaws]

[ QUOTE ]
the best Ibank in the known Universe

[/ QUOTE ]
Must be Goldman, no?

Also, to the OP, read Monkey Business before you get involved in the i-banking world. It's a pretty eye opening book. I had always envisioned myself going with this career path, but I don't think I can bring myself to now.

[thing85]

Public accounting is the way to go.


*pukes*