Shove/Fold and why

[CoolWave]

Seat 1: V DiDD (4025 in chips)
Seat 2: Dj`TiesTo (4095 in chips)
Seat 3: taxijon (8640 in chips)
Seat 4: chuck54 (2003 in chips)
Seat 5: raverjoe (6360 in chips)
Seat 6: aderkadaver (5080 in chips)
Seat 7: BrandanZ (5725 in chips)
Seat 8: L'Occhio (6010 in chips)
Seat 9: glennanmikey (7297 in chips)
L'Occhio: posts small blind 100
glennanmikey: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to BrandanZ [Ks Qs]
BrandanZ: raises 400 to 600
L'Occhio: folds
glennanmikey: calls 400
*** FLOP *** [4h Qd 7s]
glennanmikey: checks
BrandanZ: bets 500
glennanmikey: calls 500
*** TURN *** [4h Qd 7s] [5c]
glennanmikey: checks
BrandanZ: checks
*** RIVER *** [4h Qd 7s 5c] [Jd]
glennanmikey: bets 1200
BrandanZ:?? who shoves who calls who folds and why... this is a 180 man 4.40 and i am playing to win not just cash

[Hattifnatt]

I think its a fold, def not a shove.

[b-komplex]

[ QUOTE ]
I think its a fold, def not a shove.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are really beating nothing unless you have a read on him being loose.

[CoolWave]

he called 500 and prayed his half pot river bet got me off my hand. i have top pair 2nd kicker. with blinds like this i like my chances here.

[helter skelter]

[ QUOTE ]
I think its a fold, def not a shove.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why would you recommend he fold?

Only a call makes sense to me here. There are not many weaker hands that I can think of that would call a shove. You shove, he calls and shows you J7, Q5 or something similar.

Anyway, I guess ham laid it out already.

[tomek322]

why is this a post? call and move to the next hand... Did you just figured out the c-bet flop/check turn to induce bluff line? Not following?

[deepsquat]

please bet the turn every time.

Call the river.

[Willd]

I like the turn check against a lot players. Getting c/red here sucks because people are bad enough to do it with hands that you're actually beating as well as sets/weird 2 pair etc. If he was a calling station I don't mind a bet on the turn.

The river seems like a no-brainer call to me, you never get called by worse if you shove and you've underrepped your hand so he could be value betting worse.

[ssnyc]

bet more on flop..shove turn...as played just call...your hand is underrepped and he may be pushing you around...500 bet into a 1300 pot on flop is horrible unless...unless you think he may bluff raise a weak bet...hate the turn check...bet around the pot and river play becomes easier

[JSmith2007]

You seem pretty deep and you're probably above average by a little bit here.

If you're playing to win, I think a reraise to 3600 would be appropiate. I'm lazy and didn't do the math, but if you've only got a few hundred left after that then just shove obv.

The river bet looks so much like he had a weak queen and hoped you didn't have a bigger one. However, I'm afraid of that weak queen being QJ. Another thing to consider is that he's in the BB, yet another reason to call/shove IMO.

I probably lean to call here because if he hit something hard on the river, I've still got chips to play with. But if you're playing to win and not just cash/FT, then shoving is probably best.