Hand from Schneid's Blog

MonsterJ · #1 08-02-2007, 11:36 PM

PapaWarbucks: posts small blind $100
tongni1: posts big blind $200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to PapaWarbucks [7h 7s]
Quackers: raises $200 to $400
Shankar825: calls $400
Hoss_TBF: raises $200 to $600
Baffa: folds
PapaWarbucks: calls $500
tongni1: calls $400
Quackers: raises $200 to $800
Betting is capped
Shankar825: calls $400
Hoss_TBF: calls $200
PapaWarbucks: calls $200
tongni1: calls $200
*** FLOP *** [Ad 8s As]
PapaWarbucks: checks
tongni1: checks
Quackers: checks
Shankar825: checks
Hoss_TBF: bets $200
PapaWarbucks: calls $200
tongni1: folds
Quackers: folds
Shankar825: folds
*** TURN *** [Ad 8s As] [Tc]
PapaWarbucks: checks
Hoss_TBF: checks
*** RIVER *** [Ad 8s As Tc] [8h]
PapaWarbucks: checks
Hoss_TBF: bets $400
PapaWarbucks: calls $400
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Hoss_TBF: shows [9d 9h] (two pair, Aces and Nines)
PapaWarbucks: mucks hand
Hoss_TBF collected $5195 from pot

I don't know whether to call Hoss a genius or an idiot for making this river bet. My thinking on the flop is he will bet the flop with any pocket pair, or flush draw. After he checked the turn I decided it was quite possible my 77 is a higher pocket pair than he has. So, when the river counterfeits it, and he bets, it just seems entirely possible that he can be betting 66. From his perspective with his 99, I don't see how he can think I have KQo (so it'd pretty much have to be KsQs), and it's still possible I can have a JJ or whatever if I got cute and didn't cap. In any case, I think he must've bet it thinking if I had a K hi flush draw I'd call. And I called because I thought 66 could be in his range.

Am I misreading this or does his line on the river make absolutely no sense as does his explanation?

Schneids · #2 08-03-2007, 01:18 AM

oh boy this is gonna be fun...

MonsterJ · #3 08-03-2007, 01:47 AM

Not sure what that means, but why not C/R?

You have the board, and can't even beat 66, but thats what you put him on and just call, hoping for a chop?

dangerfish · #4 08-03-2007, 10:02 PM

CR never work. He will call every time here.

HOWMANY · #5 08-03-2007, 10:35 PM

[ QUOTE ]
CR never work. He will call every time here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree and am somewhat surprised that players way better than me suggested it. If we c/r here we have to be prepared to put 4 bets in (and it's quite possible that it still won't work if he has anything other than playing the board imo) because to me a c/r after this action just looks like "this is the only way I can win". I found the call quite mind boggling when I read this hand a while ago and I hated it, however I still think it is better than c/r.

dangerfish · #6 08-04-2007, 12:46 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
CR never work. He will call every time here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree and am somewhat surprised that players way better than me suggested it. If we c/r here we have to be prepared to put 4 bets in (and it's quite possible that it still won't work if he has anything other than playing the board imo) because to me a c/r after this action just looks like "this is the only way I can win". I found the call quite mind boggling when I read this hand a while ago and I hated it, however I still think it is better than c/r.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't really think you need to be prepared to put in 4 bets because I don't see why Hoss would do anything but call if you c raise him. I don't see what the big deal is with this hand. Hoss is never folding no matter what the [censored] you do. Schnied's call is not as bad as horrendous as everyone thinks either imo.

DeathDonkey · #7 08-03-2007, 01:49 AM

Makes sense to me but then Hoss' play makes sense to me too in some ways. Schneids calls tons of bets preflop and then just calls the flop with tons of people left behind him, Hoss is terrified Schneids has something like AQ or 88 and is sucking people in on the flop. Then when he checks the river Hoss knows he has the nuts IMO so I don't see why he wouldn't bet it. That's the only part of Schneids' post that doesn't make sense to me, it seems like an easy bet for Hoss but Schneids was surprised he made it.

-DeathDonkey

MonsterJ · #8 08-03-2007, 01:53 AM

Exactly, I think Hoss's play in this hand is standard. Mainly, I am just confused on the river call, it doesn't make sense to me. Isn't this a standard fold/CR situation?

Lestat · #9 08-03-2007, 12:28 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Exactly, I think Hoss's play in this hand is standard. Mainly, I am just confused on the river call, it doesn't make sense to me. Isn't this a standard fold/CR situation?

[/ QUOTE ]

c/r would've been sweet and I wonder why Schneids didn't make it. Maybe he wanted Hoss to know what he'd call with?

Schneids · #10 08-03-2007, 12:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Exactly, I think Hoss's play in this hand is standard. Mainly, I am just confused on the river call, it doesn't make sense to me. Isn't this a standard fold/CR situation?

[/ QUOTE ]

c/r would've been sweet and I wonder why Schneids didn't make it. Maybe he wanted Hoss to know what he'd call with?

[/ QUOTE ]

It took me too long (was the main reason) and I think there's some chance greater than zero that he three-bets me with board, and I also don't think he folds a better hand to my checkraise, which I could prove to be a likely true statement by digging up dozens of hand histories which verify Hoss seldom folds to me.