Wynn wouldn't let us play chinese last night

[goofball]

After a long and enjoyable 4/8 mix game at the Wynn we ran into some trouble from shift manager Katherine. The 4/8 mix was proceeding as usual; We were drinking and the dealers were getting tipped. Before I continue let me just say that I love the Wynn poker room. The dealers are good, the action is good, and the floor people are generally great at being floor people. They make good decisions, run good games, remembering players, and stay focused on what is good customer service and good for the room.

We were playing 4/8 mix and decided to start playing $5/point chinese. The dealer said fine and we starting doing chinese with a $1/rake per hand. Katherine noticed and came over to tell us we couldn't do it that way. We asked what our options were and she told us she would research it and get back to us. So we waited. After a few minutes I went and asked her and she told me it would be a few more minutes. We played and waited. Shortly she informed us that we would not be allowed to play chinese for the following reasons:

1. Chinese must be a timecharge game.
2. The Wynn does not do time charges for 4/8 games.

Katherine told us that we may start a "20/40 mix" with only chinese and play for $20/point which is way too large for us. This is also a ridiculous conclusion. Whenever I've played chinese in a mix game the $x/point has been much smaller then the small bet for the rest of the games, and a poker shift supervisor should know that.

We proposed starting a $5/point chinese game (a game i've played at wynn in the past) but she said no because wynn didn't spread chinese that low. We tried to explain that we were frustrated even though a) we wanted to pay to play poker, b) many dealers had nothing to do, and c) many tables were empty, we could not play.

We asked for the name of her supervisor and a copy of this is being sent to her (any revision suggestions are welcome). I told her that I would tell her supervisor the following. We wanted to play a game that would bring money into the room and keep good and loyal customers playing and happy. We were prevented from doing so and the obstacle was one of two things.

1. Katherine misintepreting, misapplying, or overapplying the rules.
2. The rules are very restrictive and prevent her from effectively doing her job.

Given my experience with the other floor staff both in spreading chinese and in spreading other nonconventional games, I suspect it's the former.

[StevieG]

You know, I can kinda sympathize with you in some ways, but, really, do you have to be so pissed off about this to go up the chain?

Compared to everything else at the Wynn, don't you realize how much of a bargain it is to play poker and get the level of service offered for the amount the casino is actually making? Why bring it to anyone's attention that you can't squeeze them for a little bit more?

The Wynn floor can and will drop the rake to $1/hand in short handed games at late hours, but they know there is at least some kind of payoff that the game keeps running, and it is much easier for that shorthanded game to fill up than it is to start a new game.

But the Chinese poker is not necessarily going to pull in any more players, and there are less hands per hour anyway.

They are so good about everything else for poker, why get greedy?

[AngusThermopyle]

And if those are the rules, and the other shift managers were bending them for you, then her supervisor will instruct the other managers not to let you play Chinese the way you want.

[pfapfap]

I can empathize a bit with you, too, and I've certainly gotten worked up over something while in an insulated environment... but usually when I step away a bit, I realize, hey, if this is something that gets my panties in a bunch and gets me screaming outrage, then my life in general must be pretty damn cozy.

So yeah, let it go, enjoy what you have, no need harassing someone at her job because of some confusion around playing a drunken game.

[*TT*]

[ QUOTE ]
So yeah, let it go, enjoy what you have, no need harassing someone at her job because of some confusion around playing a drunken game.

[/ QUOTE ]

1) It wasn't a drunken game, there were some locals who decided to sit in this game as well as our group. The staff at the Wynn actually asked us to bring the game to their casino the day prior when we were chatting, obviously we obliged.

2) The players in the game were going to leave, it was well into the overnight past 4am and they had no interest in playing another game. According to discussions I have had with the swing shift floor and supervisor the Wynn is trying to encourage these games provided they do not interfere with the room's mainstay games, break games, etc.

3) The group of players who were at the center of this situation have been courted by the Wynn to become regulars. If a ruling alienates a single player then so be it, but when it alienates a group of players its bad business.

Rules are made to be broken for the good of the company. I'm willing to bet Steve and Elaine Wynn wouldn't want to loose this groups business this late in the evening, the shift supervisor made an error in judgment since her ruling was not in the best interest of the Wynn. Goofball's response is exactly what he should do because it is good for the long term health of the poker room and the company, which is far more important.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[Barry]

I also think that Katherine made a bad decision. However, I wouldn't get overly excited about it. Going over her head will not help you in dealing with her in the future. Try to have a quiet conversation with her away from the table about the mutual benefit the room and the players get if that game goes. If she doesn't get it, talk to the swing guys and ask them to talk to her during the shift change.

Oh yeah, another word of advice, now that I'm not in town. Play in the 20 mixed game, it's a goldmine.

[AKQJ10]

[ QUOTE ]
Rules are made to be broken for the good of the company.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nordstrom employee handbook:
[ QUOTE ]
Rule # 1: Use your good judgment in all situations. There will be no additional rules.

[/ QUOTE ]

(Source #1, #2)

[Ol Dirty Bastard]

[ QUOTE ]
3) The group of players who were at the center of this situation have been courted by the Wynn to become regulars.

Rules are made to be broken for the good of the company. I'm willing to bet Steve and Elaine Wynn wouldn't want to loose this groups business this late in the evening, the shift supervisor made an error in judgment since her ruling was not in the best interest of the Wynn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Courted by the Wynn to be regulars.... TOOL

Rules are made to be broken??? NOT IN POKER ROOM! Because poker players will suddenly take that as the law. And any time a floor person tries to enforce the rule in the future, you stupid nits will say "NO, THE OTHER FLOOR PERSON SAID IT WAS OK. YOU ARE ALLOWED TO DO THAT!"

You people take yourselves entirely so seriously. Get lives beyond poker. You are not important to the poker rooms.

[RevAgain]

[ QUOTE ]
no need harassing someone at her job because of some confusion around playing a drunken game.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wtf? She was doing her job extremely badly and to the detriment of the OP, who as a paying customer can expect to be treated reasonably. If the facts as stated are true and there was nothing more to it, he has every right to complain. Suggesting that constitutes 'harassing' the offending party is absurd.

[DayTripping]

I find it interesting how there are certain people on this board (not naming any names) who routinely seem to have problems with management at poker rooms.