Newbie requests : Open up your game guide for ssnl

Burcak · #1 11-04-2007, 04:29 PM

Hail dear 2p2ers,

I know charts don't work due to stuff like table image, opponent stats, history, the flow of the game... But there must be "concepts" in the 2p2 TAG's minds that make them play looser than what is conceived TAG by other people...

Is it possible to make a collective work on this issue? Like, explain situations where it is possible to expand beyond regular boundaries known to newbies like me? I think such a work would also have a lot of value for almost every new comer to Hold'em.

For example, if you are raising marginally K,Q or J high hands from the button when two nits are in the blinds... that's a concept. Or, if this sucks, maybe you raise 23s? I am sure styles will differ, but +ev plays like that must make for a big winrate in the longrun.

Thanks for your time anyway.

In the end, I know there is just no benefit to you for doing this. But then again, isn't almost every strategy post ever written the same? I am sure, those who share knowledge must have a reason to do so.

netstorm · #2 11-04-2007, 04:35 PM

What you are asking for is waaaaay too broad. With the intention of opening up your game preflop, you also need to have plans postflop. Some people prefer SCs or suited one-gappers. Others prefer hands like KJo or w/e. Its all personal preferences...

Burcak · #3 11-04-2007, 04:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What you are asking for is waaaaay too broad. With the intention of opening up your game preflop, you also need to have plans postflop. Some people prefer SCs or suited one-gappers. Others prefer hands like KJo or w/e. Its all personal preferences...

[/ QUOTE ]

I understand this completely. However, raising with T9 thinking "it has top pair value" should be enough to experiment.

Ofc you can't read a post and start playing perfect poker. But without leads, it is insanely difficult too. What's beyond the basic concept (like, T9 having top pair value against a calling station) must obviously be filled with experience.

I don't know, personally, I have spent 45 days trying to understand, and 22 VPIP seems like magic to me. Once I raise 2 hands in a row, I start to feel everyone will reraise me with any 2 hands. Videos I watch (at cardrunners) for my stakes are always like 14/13. I swear if I knew the screenname of a 22/18/3 player I would watch him whenever he is online and try to see what the hell is going on.

Maybe what I am asking is impossible, but you must understand that between the guy who read some books, signed up here and started reading (who is a nit, since we said he read books) and the guy who plays 22/18/3, there is an incredible knowledge gap, and this isn't filled with reading 200 posts a day, all ssnl digests, making 50 posts asking similar things etc. (again I know this from personal experience).

If that's not the way to close that gap then what is? Is getting coached the only way?

hotbacon · #4 11-04-2007, 04:42 PM

Why are ppl so obsessed with preflop?

hotbacon · #5 11-04-2007, 04:50 PM

You want to up your VPIP/PFR? Then raise more hands, it's that simple.

But that shouldn't be your ultimate goal. Your ultimate goal at poker is to play optimally... Optimal preflop style depends greatly on how the table plays. 40/35 or 15/14 can be optimal preflop styles depending on the style.

However, playing an "optimal" preflop game is not where the money is at. You could easily play optimally preflop and lose money if you're a moron post flop. However, if you play optimally post flop, it would be pretty [censored] hard to have such an exploitable preflop style that you couldn't win at the table (ESPECIALLY at low stakes).

What I'm saying here is poker is a situational game. Stop worrying about stupid preflop numbers, and start worrying about finding other player's tendencies and figuring out how to exploit them. Yes, one way of exploiting people is by outplaying them preflop, but that is where perhaps 10% of the money really is. But doing things like value betting all 3 streets with middle pair against a guy who has a tendency to call way too much is where the REAL money is.

netstorm · #6 11-04-2007, 04:51 PM

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there is an incredible knowledge gap, and this isn't filled with reading 200 posts a day, all ssnl digests, making 50 posts asking similar things etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

yes it is. Poker is a postflop game, not a preflop game. You learn it by logging a lot of hands, and participating in this forum.

What stakes do you play?

carrotsnake · #7 11-04-2007, 04:53 PM

actually netstorm, your definately wrong. You learn some reading the forum, but nowhere near as much as if you actually went out and played more and thought more. Fwiw, hotbacon plays 2/4 and 3/6 I think and I play 5/10. <3 Seriously, start tryign to learn on your own, this forum is no longer the answer it was during party poker, for many reasons

Shizzle12345 · #8 11-04-2007, 04:55 PM

lol i have the opposite. Iv always been way too loose, and if im not carefull i end up playing 40/30 every table. I just cant understand how some guys can play 17/12. I never played that tight over more then a couple 100 hands.

Im also a strong believer of 4-5 tables max, so that makes it hard to nit it up too.

netstorm · #9 11-04-2007, 05:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
actually netstorm, your definately wrong. You learn some reading the forum, but nowhere near as much as if you actually went out and played more and thought more. Fwiw, hotbacon plays 2/4 and 3/6 I think and I play 5/10. <3 Seriously, start tryign to learn on your own, this forum is no longer the answer it was during party poker, for many reasons

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, your right there. You dont learn nearly as much from the forums as you do when playing hands. However, I feel his question was geared towards preflop play, which I think you can learn a lot about from these forums.

I think I could've made my post a little bit more readable, but when I say read the forums I assumed this goes hand in hand with thinking about the situations that are described [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Shizzle12345 · #10 11-04-2007, 05:03 PM

Also watching aba's vids will help you alot, I wouldnt watch CTS vids because those are just a bit too crazy for a nit to learn anything from it. Opening up your game should be done by finding spots where you think you are +EV. Im up with SC in early position so i happily raise those, but you gotta experiment and learn to play postflop better to find these spots. Not using pokertracker while doing this is probably best [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]