Spew/ Decent read Question (KQs/NL10)

TheBad · #1 10-19-2007, 09:10 AM

Villain was like 18/10, nothing special. (AF was low)

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

saw flop|saw showdown

Button ($9.95)
SB ($12.80)
Hero ($10.25)
UTG ($11.10)
UTG+1 ($16.85)
MP1 ($10.55)
MP2 ($3.10)
CO ($1.55)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.10, 3 folds, Button calls $0.10, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.5, UTG+1 calls $0.40, Button folds.

Flop: ($1.15) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $0.7, UTG+1 calls $0.70.

Turn: ($2.55) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $2, UTG+1 raises to $4, Hero calls $2.

River: ($10.55) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets $4, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $10.55

PF: One of my favourite hands ! I make it 3BB+1 for each limper.
Flop: Gutshot, 2 Overs, BDFD, but i was going to cbet anyway [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
Turn: Villain may have realised that i could c-bet with air here, so i decide to give it another shot. When he raises, i´m getting 1:5 so i call to see if the miracle Jack hits.
River: -> I´m wondering if this hand was total spew.

After this hand, villain instantly leaves the table. Whenever villain does so, i think he was on a bluff. You think the same ?

Mike Kelley · #2 10-19-2007, 09:15 AM

C/F Turn or B/F turn if you wanted to double barrel.

Yes, as played I think that is spew.

No villain leaving table does not mean bluff.

CaptVimes · #3 10-19-2007, 10:00 AM

Grunch

I tend to raise a little bigger from the blinds not smaller. KQ isn't a bad heads up hand, but really not something I want to be playing OOP against 2 or more people so your bet accomplished that. Button must have had just absolute junk to fold here.

I would bet 1.00 on the flop with that drawy board. This is the same as I would be with top pair, overpair or a draw too. What was villain's went to showdown or folds to C-bet #'s? Do you look at these when you cbet with air?

Turn is the spewy part of the hand. Your drawing to a gut shot, cause your overs may or may not be good. The eight, also, is not a good card for your hand but may have helped villain's. I would tend to check/fold here.

I think you need to think about your odds a bit here. In order for this call to be correct you need to be getting odds of 10.5to1 (Odds of hitting your 4 out gutshot). So you need to make $21 on the call. There's 8.50 in the pot and the most you can get out of villain is a little over $7. Does this make sense why the call is bad? Stop worrying about bluffs at NL10, especially from mostly tight players.

TheBad · #4 10-19-2007, 10:08 AM

Fold to-cbet was 100% but to small samplesize (<100 hand - I consider everything below 500 hands as to small for fold to cbet).

I guess this is a major leak in my play: When to many c-bets are called on a table i start to 2nd barrel light. Stop it. Now. Promised.

ceavou22 · #5 10-19-2007, 10:10 AM

I like a check preflop for being OOP postflop, but raising isn't horrible.

As played, isn't best of boards for c-bet but as we're HU its fine.

On turn this isn't a good card to double barrell on, prefer something like an A or T. So chk/fold turn.\

And with the ppl leaving straight after a hand, I've seen this a lot and they normally do it after a biggish pot when they want to - regardless of if they won or lost the pot.

RapidEvolution · #6 10-19-2007, 11:27 AM

*grunch*

I don't mind the raise preflop, but I'll check in these situations too. If you're raising, though, raise more (.6-.7) to charge them for playing position against you. You miss the flop and your cbet gets called. I'm not sure I like firing a second barrel on this board (3 medium cards and a low one) but folding to the turn raise is a must. You're a 9 or 10-1 underdog here (I forget) so you've got to make that money back when you hit. (between 18 and 20 dollars). At best, you stand to make a bit more than $15 (the $10.55 in the pot and 5 left in your stack [villain can only put in what you have] so even the best-case scenario is -EV.

ElectricWaffles · #7 10-19-2007, 12:37 PM

Personally I think raising PF here is kind of 50/50. I'd consider KQs to be a mix of a 'top-pair take down the flop' and a drawing hand. The first kind I'd raise PF and hope to win at the flop, the second i'm checking/limping and hoping to win a huge pot at showdown (if I hit). So my action PF would depends on position mostly.

Here you're in EP after the flop so I'd treat it like a more 'pair/flop' hand as drawing OOP I dont like. So I guess I like the raise.

I also like the size of the raise, I think rasing more can potentially inflate the pot. You're OOP and playing large pots OOP is difficult so I'd be happy to keep it smaller until I see what the flop is like.

Flop. Cbet is what i'd do, standard I think.

Turn. Not a great spot to double barrell, the 8 helped lots of hands. Also it makes a coordinated board, so if somebody puts you on a pair it gives them a good spot to try and bluff you.

Personally I'd check/fold the turn, your draws are no good, as has been explained above. So I'd fold the turn whatever really.

As played check folding the river is fine. I can't imagine villian folding to a bluff from you here, considering the way he's been putting money in on every street and the coordinated board. He's not scared of it so I think you should be.

(My advice may be no good, it's just my opinion)