($33) AQo +18bb + mp +1 ep limper = confusion

[McSturdy]

No reads.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (7 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com

CO (t2810)
Button (t5620)
SB (t1700)
BB (t3425)
UTG (t1905)
MP1 (t2750)
Hero (t1790)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls t100, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t350</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, MP1 calls t250.

Flop: (t850) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
MP1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero ? )</font>

- preflop: shove 18bb? limp? fold? raise 4bb? why?
- flop: c-bet? fold to crai? why?

Thanks for any input..

[mana013]

Raise to 350 is good. I bet out on the flop every time. You have 1440 left. If you bet half the pot that leaves you with 10bb and if he shoves i'd call. I think if you c-bet smaller you can get away from the hand if he c/r's but i'd just bet 1/2 the pot and c what happens.

[Anna.]

[ QUOTE ]
Raise to 350 is good. I bet out on the flop every time. You have 1440 left. If you bet half the pot that leaves you with 10bb and if he shoves i'd call. I think if you c-bet smaller you can get away from the hand if he c/r's but i'd just bet 1/2 the pot and c what happens.

[/ QUOTE ]

why would you auto-call every time? that seems strange. what kind of a range do you think this villain has, that you are always calling w/ 2nd pair?

personally this is one of those situations where i bet very close to pot. by doing so i would think villain would be less likely to bluff w/ a CRAI. could be very exploitable, but i doubt that's something you have to worry about the majority of the time.

[mana013]

If you bet the pot and he c/r's you would u fold that?
lets go ahead and c-bet 1/2 into the pot. Now lets say he c/r's all-in. your gonna have 10bb left and i'm basing my decision to call solely your stack size left if you were to fold.
What happens if he just calls? Which i think is more likely to happen than him c/ring you. you still have @ best 10bb left if u c-bet the flop and i dont c how we can fold the turn or river. After looking @ all the situations that can happen why not just push the flop? If he was gonna call your c-bet or c/r it i think your pot committed and will have to call so get some FE and just shove it. Makes it short and sweet.
EDIT: i have been @ work for 16 hours now and been up far longer so I could be completely off track and also that is why i kinda rambled. lol

[McSturdy]

Here's what happened on the flop:

Flop: (t850) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
MP1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t450</font>, MP1 raises all-in [t2400] , Hero calls [t990]
</font>

So I c-bet 1/2 pot and called the crai 990 (pot 3700).

My reasoning was that the range of an unknown villain contains a flush draw and weaker pairs (possibly even air) enough to make it a call getting 3:1. I'm wondering:

A) Do you pretty much have to c-bet the flop? If so, with what reads (types of villains) can you find a fold getting 3:1 with 10bb behind?

B) Is pushing the flop better than c-betting over 1/2 the pot? Why?

C) Can you do anything smart pre-flop to make post-flop easier?

[vers]

you can limp pre if you want or raise to maybe 400 or 450 to make a c-bet a larger percentage of your stack. I c-bet half pot and probably call a shove b/c the board is too drawy to fold. At least you have a backdoor flush draw and blocker ace if he hes JT.

[bulldogs24]

shove preflop

[Anna.]

depending on the table i completely agree with limp preflop, or shove preflop.
rasing to that much PF, there's no way MP1 is going to fold, then you're playing A,Qo w/ a sort of awkward stack and stuff like this happens.
if you limp, you can keep the pot a lot smaller, and follow it up w/ a smaller c-bet on the flop, which will be easier to fold if you think you're beat.
if you shove. sweet. SNG players don't like playing post flop anyway, so you can just minimize the table and see if it ever beeps again saying it's your turn to act.

[rakemeplz]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Raise to 350 is good. I bet out on the flop every time. You have 1440 left. If you bet half the pot that leaves you with 10bb and if he shoves i'd call. I think if you c-bet smaller you can get away from the hand if he c/r's but i'd just bet 1/2 the pot and c what happens.

[/ QUOTE ]

why would you auto-call every time? that seems strange. what kind of a range do you think this villain has, that you are always calling w/ 2nd pair?

personally this is one of those situations where i bet very close to pot. by doing so i would think villain would be less likely to bluff w/ a CRAI. could be very exploitable, but i doubt that's something you have to worry about the majority of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

So basicly you're getting it all in the same amount except when he wants to bluff? I dont get it.

[Q..]

I personally like it 350-400 raise preflop, and id bet 700-850 on flop so its bigger mistake to call with draws. I am not really concerned about king much, since AK would raise us allin pre, KQ is unlikely with queens in game, and KJ- dont call that.And i like postflop play, shoving preflop with 18bb and 2.5bb pot i just dislike. though it does look like +ev push.