Queens with nasty and worrying action

[Riku]

Mp2 was 24/2/0.5 after 60 hands.
Rest of the guys giving action were pretty much unknown.

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 3-bets</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 caps</font>, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls.

Flop: (21.50 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 3-bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 caps</font>, MP3 folds, Hero...

Mp1 check raise 3bets, Mmmmm.
Mp2 check caps, Sexxyy.
Im starting to think that im beat.
If there's a time to fold over pair, im thinking this might be it. However, I have a bdfd, bdsd, and 2 queen outs. Im getting around 33:2 + implied. Further, even if i make my hand, i might still loose, though.

[bozlax]

Wow, a limp-re-reraiser and a limp-capper in the same hand. You seen any funny action from these two on other hands? *wink,wink*

This looks like it might be a case of two retards sandwiching a player who at least knows what he's doing, who's playing a little too weak because he's sandwiched between two retards (probably a little looser than "normal", too, playing speculative hands). Y'know? So, MP2 might be on a flushdraw or Jx, probably x=overcard.

I'm not folding this, yet, the pot's too big and we've got position. An overcard to my pair falls, or another diamond, then I'm thinking to get out, or if I'm faced with two bets on the turn. What would really concern me is if the action on the turn goes check-check-bet.

[Miyaguchi]

I would call. The pot odds are just big enough to play with two outs. There is two gaps backdoor straight draw and backdoor flush draw with decent Queen. That gives you something about 3, maybe 3.5 outs. You've got Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] so if you make a set, it is less likely that someone else will make a flush. However you might still lose with a straight. Also there is still little chance that you have the best hand.

[Xylocain]

are you hinting on collusion Boz? Anyho, given mp2 is in the hand that plan should have backfired since there is a good chans mp2 has a set or a FD and is too often going to SD.

I don't enjoy these ultrahigh variance hands. I would prefer to have aces here or JJ. heh. In all honsety I would probably fold turn unless the action slows down to one bet-street. I'm not calling a [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

[KitCloudkicker]

[ QUOTE ]
are you hinting on collusion Boz? Anyho, given mp2 is in the hand that plan should have backfired since there is a good chans mp2 has a set or a FD and is too often going to SD.

I am still unconfotable in these ultrahigh variance hands. I would prefer to have aces here or JJ. In all honsety I would probably fold turn unless the action slows down to one bet-street. I'm not calling a [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

we have the Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] silly...

[Xylocain]

dimnit, only half way trough coffee

[bozlax]

[ QUOTE ]
are you hinting on collusion Boz?

[/ QUOTE ]

You see a player limp-cap pf after another one limp-reraises, then bet fold when the LRR c/rs the flop in a GINORMOUS pot like this, you gotta wonder. And I'm usually the first person to lol when somebody posts a, "Is this collusion?" post.

And, if a diamond turns, unless it's the K or A, you have to at least recognize the RIO situation you're in. So, just like any non-ace, non-king, I'm willing to call one, folding to two, and worried if I'm not closing the action.

[Fantam]

I must admit that this is very strange action preflop and on the flop.

I am wondering whether it might be best to not raise the flop, but consider raising a safe turn (depending upon the action of your opponents).

The pot is enormous on the flop and a flop raise will not protect your hand from many drawing hands, whereas a turn raise might.

[Aaron W.]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
are you hinting on collusion Boz?

[/ QUOTE ]

You see a player limp-cap pf after another one limp-reraises, then bet fold when the LRR c/rs the flop in a GINORMOUS pot like this, you gotta wonder. And I'm usually the first person to lol when somebody posts a, "Is this collusion?" post.

[/ QUOTE ]

Alternatively, it could also be a couple aggro donks who are trying to outplay each other. Either way, this is a situation that raises the warning flags.

[bozlax]

[ QUOTE ]
Alternatively, it could also be a couple aggro donks who are trying to outplay each other. Either way, this is a situation that raises the warning flags.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd say "opportunity" flag, but same idea. Basically, I'm going to be less likely to believe AA/KK/JJ given the preflop/flop action, but I'm also not going nutbag.