200 NL - flop good draw

[Bramsterdam]

I had a discussion about this hand, opinions?

Villain (UTG) is 30/18/2.2 after 150 hands. Effective stack $190.

Pre-flop: Hero is in SB with T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 calls, 1 fold, Button calls, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($10) 10[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Hero bets $10, 1 fold, UTG raises to $32, 2 folds, Hero ?

*additional question: Can we derive from villains stats wheter he is positional aware or not?

[delta k]

I find these spots tough. Sometimes I'll call here and see a turn but I'm more likely to do that if c/r and I have position. And I don't like a raise unless it's a shove because playing the turn OOP if we miss isn't good.

We have good equity against everything- 66 is all we're really worried about. I prob shove. Not sure if that's good or not though.

[orange]

call i think.

[delta k]

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call i think.

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Orange, can you explain a little bit why we think a call is good? 66 is all we're behind here. Shoving folds a bigger FD. Playing OOP when the turn bricks sucks, and it makes getting paid off a little tougher. I defaulted on shove because I didn't like calling here very much.

[JackAll]

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Hero ?

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Calls

[ QUOTE ]
Orange, can you explain a little bit why we think a call is good? 66 is all we're behind here. Shoving folds a bigger FD. Playing OOP when the turn bricks sucks, and it makes getting paid off a little tougher. I defaulted on shove because I didn't like calling here very much.

[/ QUOTE ]

Call because no one gets it all in with a pot that was limped pf with hands we beat.

[delta k]

[ QUOTE ]
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Hero ?

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Calls

[ QUOTE ]
Orange, can you explain a little bit why we think a call is good? 66 is all we're behind here. Shoving folds a bigger FD. Playing OOP when the turn bricks sucks, and it makes getting paid off a little tougher. I defaulted on shove because I didn't like calling here very much.

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Call because no one gets it all in with a pot that was limped pf with hands we beat.

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hands we are 'ahead' of, however.

[Bramsterdam]

I argued that Hero should 3bet or shove.

UTG prolly isn't positional aware, so he raises a lot of hands from UTG to (maybe all pocket pairs), limping hands like 98s and stuff.

3betting / shoving accomplishes the following:
- folding out bigger FD's
- Fold Equity (folding out Kx hands for example?)
- creating a wild image

imo Hero shouldn't complete pre-flop if he isn't going to make moves on flops like these. If here calls the flop reraise, there are at best 14 outs (9 clubs, 3 7's, 2 T's). Hero will hit one of his outs in 30% of the turns.

If hero doesn't hit on the turn he won't get odds to continue and won't have folding equity anymore. If villain decides to check the turn behind on this drawy board, then he prolly hasn't got a big hand so he would have folded to a 3bet on the flop.

[JackAll]

[ QUOTE ]
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Hero ?

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Calls

[ QUOTE ]
Orange, can you explain a little bit why we think a call is good? 66 is all we're behind here. Shoving folds a bigger FD. Playing OOP when the turn bricks sucks, and it makes getting paid off a little tougher. I defaulted on shove because I didn't like calling here very much.

[/ QUOTE ]

Call because no one gets it all in with a pot that was limped pf with hands we beat.

[/ QUOTE ]

hands we are 'ahead' of, however.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's true we are ahead of most of his range, but when a pot was limped pf, they will fold most of their weaker hands to a 3-bet which means we just give money to stronger hands. Not many players get 98% of their stack into a pot on the flop with a weak hand. I call here and lead most turns.

[Pete H]

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*additional question: Can we derive from villains stats wheter he is positional aware or not?

[/ QUOTE ]
Compare PFR and steal attempts.

[dragonystic]

reraise to $110. looks less like a draw, and now you are 100% committed if he shoves. you guys are less than 100bb deep. i play for stacks here all day everyday. if he shows up with a monster, he's gonna have to hope you miss.