Don't be like chiply (PokerStars player welshed)

[ethicalguy]

OK, not so much a beginner myself, but thought this would be a good spot for my first 2+2 post. Being new to 2+2 though, please forgive me (but let me know) if I break any posting rules or anything.

Don't be like chiply. Don't renege on a deal.

This was an 18p $5.50 S&G at PokerStars. We got heads up, I had a slight chiplead. It was dinner time so I suggested a 50/50 chop. It was a $9 difference, so if the guy was an ass and welshed on the deal, no big really.

Well, that's what he did. For a lousy $4.50 advantage, he reneged and was a dick about it, even swearing at me when I called him on it. (that doesn't show up here as it was observer chat.)

So anyway, don't be like chiply.

I'll post the hands here, but first the chat containing the deal.

Hero said, "50/50 chop?"
Hero said, "winner transfers $4.50 to loser"
Hero said, "allin til that happens"
chiply said, "ok"
Hero said, "deal"
Hero said, "dominated"
Hero said, "oof"
Hero said, "i'll expect that transfer...vgg"
Hero said, "oh there's more"
Hero said, "hehe"
Hero said, "supposed to keep going alin here"
Hero said, "you'll owe me $4.50"
Hero said, "OK, WAIT HERE."
Hero said, "You're reneging on the deal?"
Hero said, "You're going back on the deal?"
Hero said, "speak now chiply"
chiply said, "what adeal"
chiply said, "ok"
Hero said, "OK what?"
Hero said, "you're a real piece of work chip"
Hero said, "for a lousy $4.50 you're going to spread your crap screen name over
three different poker forums."
Hero said, "You really think that's worth it?"
chiply said, " iam trunk"
Hero said, "fess up, agree AGAIN, and lets do this right."
Hero said, "You agreed."


PokerStars Game #: Tournament ####, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/08/18 - 19:49:17 (ET)
Table '### 1' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (15091 in chips)
Seat 3: chiply (11909 in chips)
Hero: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts the ante 25
Hero: posts small blind 200
chiply: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [2d 8d]
Hero said, "50/50 chop?"
Hero said, "winner transfers $4.50 to loser"
Hero said, "allin til that happens"
chiply said, "ok"
Hero said, "deal"
Hero: raises 14666 to 15066 and is all-in
chiply: calls 11484 and is all-in
*** FLOP *** [9s As Qs]
Hero said, "dominated"
Hero said, "oof"
*** TURN *** [9s As Qs] [3s]
*** RIVER *** [9s As Qs 3s] [Kd]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
chiply: shows [Ts 8s] (a flush, Ace high)
Hero: shows [2d 8d] (high card Ace)
chiply collected 23818 from pot
Hero said, "i'll expect that transfer...vgg"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 23818 | Rake 0
Board [9s As Qs 3s Kd]
Seat 1: Hero (button) (small blind) showed [2d 8d] and lost with high card Ace
Seat 3: chiply (big blind) showed [Ts 8s] and won (23818) with a flush, Ace high



PokerStars Game #: Tournament ####, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/08/18 - 19:50:16 (ET)
Table '### 1' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (3182 in chips)
Seat 3: chiply (23818 in chips)
Hero: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts small blind 200
Hero: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [7c 7s]
Hero said, "oh there's more"
chiply: folds
Hero said, "hehe"
Hero collected 450 from pot
Hero said, "supposed to keep going alin here"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 450 | Rake 0
Seat 1: Hero (big blind) collected (450)
Seat 3: chiply (button) (small blind) folded before Flop



PokerStars Game #: Tournament ####, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/08/18 - 19:50:28 (ET)
Table '### 1' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (3407 in chips)
Seat 3: chiply (23593 in chips)
Hero: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts the ante 25
Hero: posts small blind 200
chiply: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [7d 5d]
Hero: raises 2982 to 3382 and is all-in
chiply: folds
Hero collected 850 from pot
Hero said, "you'll owe me $4.50"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 850 | Rake 0
Seat 1: Hero (button) (small blind) collected (850)
Seat 3: chiply (big blind) folded before Flop



PokerStars Game #: Tournament ####, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/08/18 - 19:50:47 (ET)
Table '### 1' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (3832 in chips)
Seat 3: chiply (23168 in chips)
Hero: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts small blind 200
Hero: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [8h 4h]
chiply: raises 800 to 1200
Hero said, "OK, WAIT HERE."
Hero said, "You're reneging on the deal?"
Hero said, "You're going back on the deal?"
Hero said, "speak now chiply"
chiply said, "what adeal"
chiply said, "ok"
Hero has timed out
Hero: folds
Hero is sitting out
chiply collected 850 from pot
chiply: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 850 | Rake 0
Seat 1: Hero (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: chiply (button) (small blind) collected (850)



PokerStars Game #: Tournament ####, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/08/18 - 19:51:54 (ET)
Table '### 1' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (3407 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 3: chiply (23593 in chips)
Hero: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts the ante 25
Hero: posts small blind 200
chiply: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [Ks 9h]
Hero: folds
chiply collected 450 from pot
chiply: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 450 | Rake 0
Seat 1: Hero (button) (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: chiply (big blind) collected (450)



PokerStars Game #: Tournament ####, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/08/18 - 19:52:01 (ET)
Table '### 1' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (3182 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 3: chiply (23818 in chips)
Hero: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts small blind 200
Hero: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [5s 9h]
Hero has returned
chiply: raises 400 to 800
Hero said, "OK what?"
Hero has timed out
Hero: folds
Hero is sitting out
Hero has returned
chiply collected 850 from pot
chiply: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 850 | Rake 0
Seat 1: Hero (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: chiply (button) (small blind) collected (850)



PokerStars Game #: Tournament ####, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/08/18 - 19:52:38 (ET)
Table '### 1' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (2757 in chips)
Seat 3: chiply (24243 in chips)
Hero: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts the ante 25
Hero: posts small blind 200
chiply: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [6h 3d]
Hero: calls 200
chiply: checks
*** FLOP *** [As 8c 4c]
chiply: checks
Hero: checks
*** TURN *** [As 8c 4c] [7s]
chiply: checks
Hero: checks
*** RIVER *** [As 8c 4c 7s] [Js]
chiply: bets 23818 and is all-in
Hero said, "you're a real piece of work chip"
Hero: folds
chiply collected 850 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 850 | Rake 0
Board [As 8c 4c 7s Js]
Seat 1: Hero (button) (small blind) folded on the River
Seat 3: chiply (big blind) collected (850)



PokerStars Game #: Tournament ####, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/08/18 - 19:54:03 (ET)
Table '### 1' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (2332 in chips)
Seat 3: chiply (24668 in chips)
Hero: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts the ante 25
chiply: posts small blind 200
Hero: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [Ks 3d]
chiply: calls 200
Hero said, "for a lousy $4.50 you're going to spread your crap screen name over three different poker forums."
Hero: checks
*** FLOP *** [Jc Ts Qh]
Hero said, "You really think that's worth it?"
chiply said, " iam trunk"
Hero said, "fess up, agree AGAIN, and lets do this right."
Hero: checks
chiply: bets 800
Hero said, "You agreed."
Hero: raises 1107 to 1907 and is all-in
chiply: calls 1107
*** TURN *** [Jc Ts Qh] [8h]
*** RIVER *** [Jc Ts Qh 8h] [3h]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Hero: shows [Ks 3d] (a pair of Threes)
chiply: shows [8s Qc] (two pair, Queens and Eights)
chiply collected 4664 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 4664 | Rake 0
Board [Jc Ts Qh 8h 3h]
Seat 1: Hero (big blind) showed [Ks 3d] and lost with a pair of Threes
Seat 3: chiply (button) (small blind) showed [8s Qc] and won (4664) with two pair, Queens and Eights

[EN09]

Don't believe I would've spent the time to register, type and post this for just a $4.50 burn. Anyhows... Live and learn and report to 'stars with the chat log. Oftentimes they'll do what's right by chat agreements.

EN

[ethicalguy]

You're right, and as I said, it is only $4.50.

Though I did try that with Stars and they say there was no evidence of a firm agreement.

Not sure why not tho.

[pzhon]

It looks like there was a deal to me.

What I have done in the past is to e-mail PokerStars support while the tournament is still going, with "Chop at tournament ###" in the subject line. In a couple of minutes, a PokerStars representative will come to the table, verify that there is an agreement, and transfer the money afterwards, even if only $4 is at stake.

[16710Pepsi]

While it is true that a bet, any bet or in this case deal is a gentlemen's agreement and should be treated accordingly, there is a big problem in this deduction.
There just aren't many men or women of honor around anymore.

That being said ... I don't think that that guy even understood what you wanted of him and probably felt overrun by your proposal anyway.
While I can understand your dismay, I fail to convict your opponent of any devious behavior.


good day
timo

[Jiganti]

My friend, do not ever post in BBV. You will be chewed up and spit out with emotional scars that are not removable.