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  #1  
Old 05-12-2007, 11:55 PM
alexdered alexdered is offline
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Default Raising or folding on the flop - calling is wrong, or is it???

Having read both Small stakes holdem and holdem for advanced players and build my bankroll so that I can play 2-4$ and have taken shots at 3-6$ even I am still struggling to understand whats wrong and whats right postflop play. Don't want to get too philosophical but in life often there is no wrong and right and often it depends on many factors. In poker I would say the play that yields the highest expectation can be labelled as correct but again this depends on your opponents... Anyway I recall getting some addvice from both books that contardicts a little... In small stakes holdem on page 96 an example is given where a player calls a raise with Q7s and flops middle pair and a backdoor flush draw... the players call (on the flop) was labelled a bigger mistake than hes preflop call... a raise was correct (on the flop)... then in holdem for advanced players a similar example was given where a player calls with K5s flops top pair and folds when someone bets... This confuses me!!! I know that one is aimed at 3-6$ limits and the other at 20-40$ but even the 1-2$ games that i most often play are relatively tight so I don't know which advice to follow... i know that in a bigger pot one gets higher odds and raising is aimed at knocking out opponents to protect your hand and buy outs... your risking being reraised and that gets a little expensive... thanks for your responses in advance...
-Alex
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  #2  
Old 05-13-2007, 02:05 AM
gull gull is offline
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Default Re: Raising or folding on the flop - calling is wrong, or is it???

The pot is way bigger in the Q7 hand.
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  #3  
Old 05-13-2007, 08:15 PM
TomTom TomTom is offline
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Default Re: Raising or folding on the flop - calling is wrong, or is it???

The K5s hand was played iun LP against 5 players for a single bet, and is being played basically for flush value only; if anyone shows interest in a K-high flop you get away from that hand.

My last trip to AC for live 2/4 I pulled my two biggest pots with K3s both times. Once when I hit my flush on the turn, the other when no one raised a K high drawless flop (so in LP I was safe to bet my top pair no kicker).

I tend to think of K-5 (only in diamonds, of course) as the Sklansky hand.
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  #4  
Old 05-13-2007, 10:46 PM
johnnyrocket johnnyrocket is offline
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Default Re: Raising or folding on the flop - calling is wrong, or is it???

the pot is way bigger in the Q7 hand and raising may knock out players and give u a higher chance to win, u can check for free cards on later streets

the K5 is going to be dominated often and the pot is too small that calling will not show a profit in the long run, hope this helps, its not too complicated
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  #5  
Old 05-14-2007, 03:01 AM
alexdered alexdered is offline
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Default Re: Raising or folding on the flop - calling is wrong, or is it???

Thanks for the replies, I double-checked the situations and indeed there is a difference in the pot size that justifies the actions taken.

Oh another question i wanted to ask, I recall reading that when your hand is usually worth a call, its usually worth a raise too (on the flop that is) so that this would be one of those raise or fold situations... Are these raise or fold situations only preflop (excluding cold calls with AJs and KQs) and on the flop?? Also on the flop I remember reading that calling is very seldom the correct play, so what is the reason behind this?
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  #6  
Old 05-14-2007, 11:03 AM
DeadMoneySimm DeadMoneySimm is offline
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Default Re: Raising or folding on the flop - calling is wrong, or is it???

There's no such thing as the "correct play", per se... only, what is the BEST play in the given situation. If you only raise or fold all the time, you miss out on lots of opportunity to disguise your hand and trap your opponents (NL of course).

Calling in the flop is great when you flop a monster...not s great when you have top pair and a T for a kicker, or middle two pair. You need to raise to get information.
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  #7  
Old 05-14-2007, 08:16 PM
oober oober is offline
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Default Re: Raising or folding on the flop - calling is wrong, or is it???

There are so many aspects of flop play. Calling is ok against weak players who give up on hands too easily. Most times when floating is profitable. Such as using a scare card to take a pot away.

As what was mentioned above, there is no such thing as the correct play, when an infinite amount of variables could contribute to your decision.

Experience should teach you this over time.
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