Atheist book comparison

[ChrisV]

In the last couple of months, I have read:

- "The God Delusion", Richard Dawkins
- "God: The Failed Hypothesis", Victor Stenger
- "The End Of Faith", Sam Harris

The God Delusion has perhaps been discussed most extensively on this forum. Dawkins opens by attacking religion on philosophical grounds, then shifts to a complexity-based argument against design (the "Ultimate 747"), then moves on to Darwinian insights about morality. It wasn't a bad book for atheists, there are some items of interest and some ammunition for debates. I definitely wouldn't recommend it to theists since Dawkins' tone of incredulity at the stupidity of all religious people would be a bit grating. I'd give this a B.

Victor Stenger is a physicist and attacks religion on general scientific grounds. I had a number of problems with this book. The first is the ridiculously overstated subtitle "How Science Shows That God Does Not Exist". Bit of an absurd claim. The second is that Stenger is a pretty bad writer. I found myself skipping over paragraphs simply to avoid Stenger's prose and get to whatever his point was. The third thing was that it turned out that the subtitle was no accident; he would frequently end chapters by saying that some property of the universe was "exactly what you'd expect if there is no God". OK, so the no-God hypothesis works fine, but that doesn't mean you've shown the God hypothesis is not consistent with the same property. Stenger's carelessness irritated even me as an atheist, I imagine theists would be screaming at the page. There's a bit of material attacking the "fine tuned universe" argument, but a lot of it is pretty speculative and really the answer "we don't know why the universe is like that" suits me fine at the moment. Not a recommended book. C-.

Next up The End Of Faith. This is a lot more like it. For starters, Sam Harris is light years beyond the other two in terms of writing ability, as those who have read his debate with Andrew Sullivan will have noted. He not only confronts religion on the ground it should be confronted on - philosophy - but with a degree in philosophy and a doctorate on the neurology of belief in the works, he is the only one of the three equipped to do so. He is clearly a very intelligent and widely-read man, and while he leaves the reader in no doubt of his fierce antipathy to religion, his focus is generally on the beliefs themselves and not those who hold them (cf Dawkins). As a result I think his book would be a lot more palatable to the sort of theists who are open to rational debate.

End Of Faith gets a solid A. I'm probably going to read some scifi or something for a while now, but when I get back to anti-theism, next on my list are (of course) Sam Harris's "Letter To A Christian Nation", and Christopher Hitchens' "God Is Not Great". I've read that this latter one is written from a literary and historical perspective, which is a new angle. Also, Hitchens is one of my favourite writers, so I'm hoping he can outdo even Harris on quality of prose.

[Justin A]

I just started reading the Stenger book. In your opinion is it worth finishing?

[vhawk01]

I've read God Delusion and End of Faith and I think your reviews are spot on. EoF is clearly the superior book, and is one of the best books I've read this year.

Ergo, I'll be skipping the Stenger one, thanks.

[thylacine]

- "The God Delusion", Richard Dawkins -------- A

- "The End Of Faith", Sam Harris -------- C+

- "God: The Failed Hypothesis", Victor Stenger -------- I've just got it and haven't read it yet. I'm looking forward to it.

[vhawk01]

[ QUOTE ]
- "The God Delusion", Richard Dawkins -------- A

- "The End Of Faith", Sam Harris -------- C+

- "God: The Failed Hypothesis", Victor Stenger -------- I've just got it and haven't read it yet. I'm looking forward to it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whoa, really? You didn't like EoF? Any particular beefs?

[thylacine]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
- "The God Delusion", Richard Dawkins -------- A

- "The End Of Faith", Sam Harris -------- C+

- "God: The Failed Hypothesis", Victor Stenger -------- I've just got it and haven't read it yet. I'm looking forward to it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whoa, really? You didn't like EoF? Any particular beefs?

[/ QUOTE ]

It was okay. (Maybe I grade tough.) It's just that I liked "The God Delusion" better by a sizable margin. Couldn't be bothered expanding.

[ChrisV]

[ QUOTE ]
I just started reading the Stenger book. In your opinion is it worth finishing?

[/ QUOTE ]

Read the "Cosmic Evidence" and "The Uncongenial Universe" chapters as they contain all the original material. The other chapters are poorly written rehashes of old arguments.

[Justin A]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I just started reading the Stenger book. In your opinion is it worth finishing?

[/ QUOTE ]

Read the "Cosmic Evidence" and "The Uncongenial Universe" chapters as they contain all the original material. The other chapters are poorly written rehashes of old arguments.

[/ QUOTE ]

K thanks.

I just picked up the End of Faith and I plan on making that my next project.

[Prodigy54321]

I am in the midst of The End OF Faith..heven't read the other two..although I have the God Delusion.

So far, Harris' book seems that it could be effective with respect to religous readers..probably moreso than a dawkins like approach..

It's pretty much what I expected from what I had heard from other people as well as what I've seen Harris say about it.

It really isn't a book for atheists though IMO..

I picked it up mostly because I believe he will be goes into his thoughts on the role of science in mysticism and spiritual experiences and those types of things..

Harris seems to kind of stand somewhat alone in his belief that these experiences are actually meaningful..

I'm not sure what he thinks about it exactly..but I should be getting into that part of the book when I have a chance to read some more..

what do you guys think of Harris' apparent facination with this type of thing..it seems like others in Harris' league dismiss them more easily..

[JussiUt]

Well, I have read Harris' and Dawkins' books and while I enjoyed both of them I liked the language of God Delusion more. Harris has a tendency of saying something relatively simple in an incredibly complicated way and while that may be eloquent I as someone who is not fluent in English found it difficult to follow sometimes.

And what comes to the content, both books are quite brilliant. Like a few have already said, Harris' book suits a religious reader better perhaps but I would still rank Dawkins' book higher just because it's more comprehensive.

Harris definately values meditative and mystic experiences more than most other authors or at least he's paying more attention to them and some of the atheists actually dislike Harris' book because of that. I found it an interesting read. It's a fact that meditation can give you experiences that you wouldn't normally have and it has nothing to do with God or religion. It's how you can activate or explore that part of your brain/conciousness. I don't think Dawnkins for example denies the effects of meditation but his point of view is more in line of his profession as a biologist.

Has anyone read Harris' The Letter To a Christian Nation and if so was it worth a read? Is it aimed at Christians? Would I as an atheist European get much out of it?