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  #1  
Old 04-11-2007, 05:52 AM
kabouter kabouter is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 1,649
Default I need some help with getting back in the game.

Ok I feel kind of embarrassed writing this, but here it goes:

I have a couple of leaks in my game, and honestly I have no idea if they are big/small. I summed them up so it's easier to answer them. I played as high as 200nl, but mostly 100nl 2 months ago. Right now I'm barely playing break even at 50nl though (probably variance, but just want to fix some leaks).

1. pocket pairs
22-66 I tend to limp with these in tables that got a very low PFR percentage (10nl/25nl), otherwise I'm mostly raising them up, or calling a raise.
77-99 I raise these at practically all tables, or call a raise.
TT-AA I raise/3bet these depending on the opponent

Am I getting the right odds to call for example 4xbb with 22? I used to think I do, but I'm not quite sure anymore.

2. Connectors in the SB
Let's assume full stacks, a couple of limpers (25nl). I get 78o or higher (89/9T) the SB is 0.10 0,15 more to call. Should I call these if I know the BB is 90% unlikely to raise it up. I'm not sure if I should call 78, but I always assumed calling with T9o was ok.

3. Calling a raise with SC
Ok let's assume full stacks again 6max, I am in the CO or BB
TJs or higher- I call/reraise
87s-T9s - What is my play here? Most of the time I throw these away, unless I think the villain is easy to stack.


I've probably got a lot more leaks then these, but these are the biggest ones.
Not that I think I'm a terrible player, but at 100nl, hands matter less, as people respect your raises/can lay down hands. At 25nl I should play my hands more, and rely less on betting/bluffing, which I can rarely adapt too. But I need to fix these leaks first before I'm moving up again.
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  #2  
Old 04-11-2007, 06:01 AM
Loc0Loc0 Loc0Loc0 is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Grindin\' 100NL
Posts: 357
Default Re: I need some help with getting back in the game.

1. Pocketpairs

Raise them allways no matter what your position is. Just don't raise to much for the rule of 5 and 10.

2. Unsuited connectors...
Insta fold...

You could complete some SC's though... Here is a very nice peace i found on 2+2..

[ QUOTE ]
**Dutch** Naar aanleiding van 'discussie' over de 5/10 regel voor pocketpairs in andere thread, leek het me wel interessant om onderstaande post van 2+2 hier te plaatsen. Dit geeft wat inzicht in de waarde van (low) suited connectors. Ik probeer ze zelf meer en meer te spelen (coldcall raise) als ik positie heb en de stacks deep genoeg zijn 125BB+.
Dit is vooral van toepassing op cashgames, aangezien je in tourneys vaak niet zulke deepe stacks hebt en dus de odds niet hebt om te callen. **Dutch off**

A recent thread about using the 5/10 rule to call preflop raises with PPs and suited connectors got me thinking about the kind of implied odds required to call preflop raises with SCs; people tend to arbitrarily use things like the 5/10 rule, even though I've never seen any mathematical description of the kind of odds you need to call these raises. I'm going to attempt to solve that problem (but I still need some help!).

I'll list the conclusions first, and leave the tl;dr math for the bottom for those of you that want to peruse it. I also encourage math-head-types to check my math to make sure I didn't mess anything up.

There are two kinds of hands you can flop with SCs: Good made hands (most of which can be made by calling with ATC, which of course we don't do) and draws. First, made hands, stolen off some page I googled:

Odds of flopping...
Flush: 0.84%
Two pair: 2%
Trips: 1.35%
Full house: 0.09%
Quads: 0.01%
Straight: 1.31%
-------
Total: 5.6% (1 in 18 times, 17:1)

However, most of the time you will be flopping draws instead of big hands with SCs, and that's where things get complicated. Let's separate this into two categories: combo draws and regular draws.

COMBO DRAWS

Odds of flopping...
20 outer (OESD + FD + pair): 0.077%
17 outer (Gutshot + FD + pair): 0.153%
15 outer (OESD + flush draw): 1.424%
14 outer (Pair + flush draw): 1.450%
13 outer (Pair + straight draw): 1.147%
12 outer (Gutshot + flush draw): 2.664%
------------------------
Total: 6.9% (1 in 14 times, 13:1)

These draws are all hands that can be played profitably after the flop; either you are a favorite against an overpair, or getting AI on the flop is +EV when you take some fold equity (and thus taking down dead money) into account.

Combining these big draws with good made hands, you'll have a relatively "big hand" on the flop 12.5% of the time, or 1 in 8 (very close to how often you will flop a set with an overpair). However, since a set is a near-invincible hand and you still have to improve with these draws, you can't say that you also need about 7:1 odds to call with a suited connector. Your average equity on the flop with these made hands and combo draws against an overpair is 66% (the made hands go from 75%-99%; the combo draws range from 45%-65%); compare this with sets, where your equity is generally 90+%.

REGULAR DRAWS

Odds of flopping...
9 outer (flush draw): 5.2%
8 outer (straight draw): 8.0%
-----------------
Total: 13.2% (1 in 7.5 times, 6.5:1)

These are your standard draws; when you flop a hand with which you can continue, it will most frequently be one of these. These draws improve to a flush or straight on the river about 1 time in 3.

Summary

- you have a 5.6% (1 in 18, 17:1 chance) of flopping a good made hand
- you have a ~7% (1 in 14, 13:1) chance of flopping a strong (12+ outs) combo draw
- you have a ~13% chance (1 in 7.5, 6.5:1) chance of flopping a standard OESD or FD

Adding these all together, you will flop a hand you can continue with on the flop 25% of the time (1 in 4). However, only half of the time will these hands be immediately profitable (i.e. +EV to shove it in); the other half, you'll have your standard old OESD or FD which requires playing some poker

[/ QUOTE ]

3. SC's
Don't raise SC's above JTs ... You are easily dominated. I'd rather 3bet with 78s when the stacks are deep enough (125BB+).. I fold High SC's to a raise.
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  #3  
Old 04-11-2007, 06:25 PM
Sean Fraley Sean Fraley is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Ohio, United States
Posts: 974
Default Re: I need some help with getting back in the game.

[ QUOTE ]
1. Pocketpairs

Raise them allways no matter what your position is. Just don't raise to much for the rule of 5 and 10.

[/ QUOTE ]

This advice is fine.

[ QUOTE ]
2. Unsuited connectors...
Insta fold...

[/ QUOTE ]

This advice is not so fine. Unless you are at a table full of shorties these are fine to limp from the cutoff or button. Feel free to call raises with these if you have the button and the effective stack sizes are at least a full buyin. If the pot is limped and you are in the cutoff feel free to raise these if the button is tight enough that a preflop raise will likely buy you the button.

[ QUOTE ]
Don't raise SC's above JTs ... You are easily dominated. I'd rather 3bet with 78s when the stacks are deep enough (125BB+).. I fold High SC's to a raise.

[/ QUOTE ]
Why would you 3-bet with hole cards that leave 6 higher flushes possible, but not with cards that only have 3 higher flushes possible? Just keep in mind that domination is an issue and play these more for straight/flush possibility than top pair value. You are perfectly fine cold-calling raises with theses, especially when the stacks are deep.
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