Call short stack with AK?

DannyOcean_ · #1 03-07-2007, 03:36 AM

Here's a somewhat theoretical question. I was at NL10 when this happened, but the questin can also apply to any micro limit.

I'm on the button. A short stack who we havent seen make any kind of play (assume we or he just sat down) open pushes. Obv. if he has 3BB's easy call, if he has 500BB's (no longer a short stack) easy fold. What is the highest amount of BB's you will call for against an unknown open push with AK?

Would you call a SS with 10BB's?
25BB's?

Would the level (NL10, NL25, etc.) affect your decision much?

payoff wizard · #2 03-07-2007, 03:39 AM

Without a read or any money in the pot, i'm more than happy to let shorty have his 15c. 10bbs I might have a gamble.

ajmargarine · #3 03-07-2007, 03:44 AM

100bb's. Any level. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

thac · #4 03-07-2007, 03:46 AM

I'd be more inclined to do it in the BB when there's no one left to act.. sometimes I'll call on the button up to 20bbs just because AQ-AJ is so much a part of their range.. if blinds wake up with a hand and shove over the top, you can fold pretty easily unless they're shortstacked as well.

Hoffma · #5 03-07-2007, 03:50 AM

I think it's right to call (or in certain situations, go all in yourself) if shorty only has about 10-15% of your stack. You are 30% against KK, 6% against AA, a slight dog against lower PPs, and a slight favorite against any other hand in villain's range. This is high variance no matter what he's holding, so just be aware of what you're doing here.

Michael Fish · #6 03-07-2007, 04:54 AM

Shorties really get on my nerves and i really enjoy busting them. Up to 18BB i call all day long, 20 i think a while and call. AQ AJ A10s 99 88 77 are hands i've seen loads and loads of shorties pushing. A worst case is a reraise from the blinds but rare enough not to worry too much about. As thac said much better as a blind.

It's more likely if a blind is comming into the hand to they'll call and try to get a cheap showdown normaly mid pp 77, 88 (this is based on my experiences of 25NL). In that case You've got position a good hand and should be happy to play out a side pot.

It breaks down into the following:
His hand is dominated: You more than likely win, wipe out shortie and bigger stack sits down [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Your Hand is dominated: You more than likely loose and wipe out shortie a few hands later and a bigger stack sits down [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Flip: You win and wipe out shortie and bigger stack sits down or you loose and wipe out shortie in the furture, bigger stack sits down [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

To be honest I'm a lot more inclided to gamble with shorties these days, especialy if they're the only one at the table. I really think that removing the disruption to game flow these fellas cause is worth it. Also the benifit of letting others player know you've got a bit of reckless side [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] does wonders for table image and getting more action.

Sure it's higher variance but hell you've got to live a little.

Freelancer · #7 03-07-2007, 05:18 AM

open pushing 100bb's?? I often snapcall with AK lol...

Anything below that I obviously call as well, and above that I start to second guess myself.

Seriously if someone is open shoving there stack in they generally suck so I'm willingly to take a shot at stacking there AQ/KJ/whatever...

Edit; I also shove over a shortie's push if its 25bb's or more (just about, don't have a exact number in my head) and rarely coldcall them.

Gelford · #8 03-07-2007, 05:25 AM

[ QUOTE ]
open pushing 100bb's?? I often snapcall with AK lol...

Anything below that I obviously call as well, and above that I start to second guess myself.

Seriously if someone is open shoving there stack in they generally suck so I'm willingly to take a shot at stacking there AQ/KJ/whatever...

[/ QUOTE ]

guess who · #9 03-07-2007, 09:00 AM

Up to 20BB I call for sure.
Everything else read dependent.

GoadToad · #10 03-07-2007, 09:11 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Seriously if someone is open shoving there stack in they generally suck

[/ QUOTE ]

yes but (talking about someone shoving a 100bb stack) the nature of that suckitude is open shoving strong pairs more than open shoving any two. They suck because they are wasting the value of their hand, you call with a buy-in sized stack you are sponsoring their bad play.

Even if it is slightly positive ev in isolation, you have to consider the fact that he's more likely to leave the table, win or lose. Isn't it more ev to let him sit there sucking and get up against him with larger edges?