Starting out...

mayers4 · #1 02-08-2007, 02:33 PM

I wanted some opinions from people that have been playing online poker for a while. How likely is it to start with a couple hundred dollars and build it into a healthy bankroll (atleast a couple thousand). I know there are probably some crazy success stories about how someone started with 50 bucks and is not sitting at the highest poker tables. But really that is one in a thousand or more.

Lets assume that skill wasnt the biggest issue. Lets let the player be a pretty decent poker player. How likely is it that if you gave them 200-300 and they logged time in everyday, that they would move up in limits, and continue to move up in limits. Poker is fun, and I love playing it, but everyone has to aggree, profit is one thing you consider as well. From a money making stand point, playing hours a day to make 5 to 10 bucks isnt worth it if the chances of finally getting to big cash games are very small.

So bottom line... is small stakes online poker beatable? Can someone grind through it given that they are slightly above average in terms of skill? What time frame are we looking at? Also, what is the best way to beat the low limits, playing NL, limit, SNGs?? Thanks for your input.

Poker Plan · #2 02-08-2007, 02:49 PM

Your question is very open-ended.

But one observation so far: Your goal / focus is obviously on money. IMHO this isn't good for becoming a good player. The money is almost secondary- it will come if you develop your game. If you are pre-occupied with that pot in the middle- you are not going to be concentrating on the 101 other things you should be.

I may be wrong- but you sound like you're just after a quick way to make some decent cash? Nothing wrong with that goal- I'm just not of the opinion that poker is the answer.

Don't take anything that I've typed as negative. I wish you the best of luck- but please thing clearly about your motives for playing- because they will certainly influence your progress.

Ian

RedGladiator · #3 02-08-2007, 03:13 PM

Most people make a loss. Breaking even requires you play better than average due to the rake.
You seem to be asking how difficult it is to become a profession player?!

Small stakes online poker is beatable but you have to manage your bank roll well.

ottsville · #4 02-08-2007, 03:42 PM

Small stakes online poker is definitely beatable. Rake is a concern, but at the nano limits(less than .5/1 limit), the play is so bad that you can play basic poker and have a solid winrate.

However, if money is your main concern, go get a job. Poker can be profitable, but it does take a lot of work, discipline, focus, skill, etc. to make a living at.

Games are also getting tougher thanks to the current legal situation here in the US. I suspect that will continue as the losing players who still have money online lose it and decide the hassle of depositing is not worth it. Not so long ago, you could make a couple of grand a month playing 1/2 and aggressively bonus whoring. Those times are gone....

Poker Plan · #5 02-08-2007, 03:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Not so long ago, you could make a couple of grand a month playing 1/2 and aggressively bonus whoring. Those times are gone....

[/ QUOTE ]

What would you say is realistically possible now, at 1/2 with bonus whoring? (say 10-14 hours / week)

ottsville · #6 02-08-2007, 04:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not so long ago, you could make a couple of grand a month playing 1/2 and aggressively bonus whoring. Those times are gone....

[/ QUOTE ]

What would you say is realistically possible now, at 1/2 with bonus whoring? (say 10-14 hours / week)

[/ QUOTE ]

IIRC, you're on the other side of the pond, so you will have more bonuses open to you. But you can figure this out by some simple math once you figure out clearance rates for bonuses.
winrate x hands played + bonuses.

Frankly, I think the games at 1/2 suck these days which will also affect your final number.

mayers4 · #7 02-08-2007, 05:01 PM

Thanks for your reply. Sorry I didnt get all the details across. This is not my first time depositing and playing poker online. I know this is all opinion, but I feel like I have the basics down. I focus more on reading people and predicting patterns than how to play KJo. Again, I know anyone can say "yeah I am a good poker player". But again I would like to approach this topic in a way that "how good a player is" is not of high concern.

My problem has always been playing under rolled. Lets face it, it can be fun playing on the big tables. I understand that I will never be a winning player like that, but that was my choice. I am now trying to consider if it would be worth my time to try to grind my way up the levels. I dont have to be playing 5/10 or anything to be happy. I just find it hard to play .5/.10 for 6 months to move up to .10/.20. That might be a flaw of mine, but I am sure you can relate how it might be more enjoyable to play 1/2 than .25/.50. I am not really looking to live off of my poker earnings, in fact even if I had several thousand, I couldnt see myself withdrawing anything unless I REALLY needed it.

Maybe instead of asking what your opinion of my plan is, I should ask "How many of you have grinded through the smaller stakes. Was it NL or limit. What was your experience like"

Thanks again for any input

Poker Plan · #8 02-08-2007, 05:19 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Maybe instead of asking what your opinion of my plan is, I should ask "How many of you have grinded through the smaller stakes. Was it NL or limit. What was your experience like"

Thanks again for any input

[/ QUOTE ]

I started out with a $25 deposit 13 months ago. Never played poker for money before that. Started at 2c/4c, then 5c/10c and now at 10c/20c. I've taken the $25 upto $98.

To be honest, it's been a ball ache generally- but I've learnt LOADS and the experience will hopefully be a solid foundation. All this is at Limit, btw.

Ian

ottsville · #9 02-08-2007, 09:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
My problem has always been playing under rolled. Lets face it, it can be fun playing on the big tables. I understand that I will never be a winning player like that, but that was my choice. I am now trying to consider if it would be worth my time to try to grind my way up the levels.

[/ QUOTE ]

No one says you have to start at any one level and stay there if you don't want. The guidelines that people use for bankroll really only apply if you never wanted to/weren't able to deposit more in your poker account. I started at .5/1 because that was where money mattered to me. I could afford to throw enough in for higher games but I played where I felt comfortable and could take the game seriously. Playing .05/.1 was a joke to me.

That said, starting low and forcing yourself to follow a disciplined plan for moving up can be a good thing too. Self discipline and bankroll management are two very important skills to develop and it is much cheaper to learn that at low levels. Also, you'll get a lot of experience that will help you as you move along.

[ QUOTE ]
I just find it hard to play .5/.10 for 6 months to move up to .10/.20.

[/ QUOTE ]

Using a 300bb roll as a guideline, it really shouldn't take that long to double your roll at this level. 4-8bb/100 is not unheard of at these levels(I have seen results that were over 8 for several K hands), so it should only ~5k to 7.5k hands to double up assuming you are a winning player.

QTip · #10 02-15-2007, 01:52 PM

I'm not sure how doable it is now that the climate has changed. However, I did take $300 and turned it into almost $60,000 simply grinding out Limit Small Stakes games. If I was single, I'd probably still be giving it a go. Although, it doesn't have near the glamour I think most imagine.

QTip
http://www.auctiva.com/stores/viewstore.aspx?id=329306