Does anyone lay this down?

[odomination]

After a long time of playing Omaha 8 limit ive started to play and learn PLO8. Ive been playing mostly .25-.50 and over my first 4600 hands I am 14bb/100.

One of my first hands at a new table.

Full Tilt Poker
Pot Limit Omaha Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
9 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (9 players) Hero is Button with 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP1 raises to $1.75</font>, MP2 calls, 2 folds, Hero calls, SB calls, BB folds.

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($7.5, 4 players)
SB checks, <font color="#cc0000">MP1 bets $2.5</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $10</font>, SB folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP1 raises to $33.5</font>, MP2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $62</font>, <font color="#cc0000">MP1 calls all-in $11.65</font>.
Uncalled bets: $16.85 returned to Hero.

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($100.3, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $100.3)


River: J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($100.3, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $100.3)


Results:
Final pot: $100.3

I wanted to lay it down deep down but I thought that that was too big of a laydown for this level. Against an unknown is this a push or a fold?

[Assani Fisher]

I probably fold preflop. No reason to play that out of position.

I probably flat call the flop. I see people betting draws like this often and I think its better to just call because you have a good shot of quartering someone if you hit and you'll lose a lot less when you don't hit.

With that said, once you've already raised it and he re-raises a call or re raise is reasonable.

[StrikeR300]

You were never afraid of aces pf? Many unknowns at this level only raise these, and that's what makes this scenario a clear fold IMHO. With an idea about the pfr'er play &amp; suitedness it could be an easy call however, especially on the button with a caller.

[Habib Marwan]

no one lays this down at any level

[odomination]

ok sweet. I feel better now.

[bbartlog]

I like playing hands like this and wouldn't lay this down either. However, I really don't see why I need to play this hand so fast. I wouldn't have put in the final reraise to $62 on the flop.

The other point is that some players will *only* pot preflop if they have AAxx, preferring smaller raises for A23x and the like. (I used to play this way until I realized I was leaking too much information). If there's a decent chance of that then I don't even put in the $10 raise on the flop, though I'd still call this down in case A23x is trying to steal...

[rando]

Would anyone change their view of this scenario if, say, there were two limps in front of MP1's raise? IOW, does an open-pot mean much less than a larger pot raise behind limpers?

For this hand, I get the sense that odomination was trying to represent a peddler's image, thus the fast play. It seems likely that this is a profitable line to take in general, given that most opponents in this spot would get into trouble when they didn't flop the only higher set, and the board didn't hit even a baby flush or broadway straight draw. Ahhh, the beauty of PLO8.

[odomination]

The only reason that I beat myself up over this hand is that looking back on it, and I thought about it during the hand but couldnt let it go, was that the board was soooooo dry. I'd have felt much better about putting the money in if there were 2 to a flush or an A4k instead of A7k because then his range would have something conceivable that could push. As played, I thought that when he repotted the flop I should either fold or shove but i'd only put in 12$ to the pot and I'd be committing another 32 to possibly get 44 back if he does have Aces. The problem with this board is that I felt like that could be his ONLY range. There are 3 ways to have AA but only one way to have AK and its hard to conceive that he has 77. So unless he played it strangely with a TJQA or A723 then it looked like I was boned. The one reason I called was b/c Ive had to many WTF moments at .25-.50 where plays I see don't make a lick of sense.

[berserk]

Given the preflop raise, I'm 100% sure he has aa23, probably suited. However, I agression in position is good, so I like your call hoping to hit either KKKK on the flop or at least escape with a quarter if you flop a wheel. Top set is also sometimes good, but I usually wait for safe cards before I commit myself.

This flop, however, puts you in the uncomfortable spot of having middle set and only a nut low draw. You're drawing to low outs for 1/4 on the flop, and you're drawing to one out for high. However, given the three way preflop, it's likely that the 4th ace is out, so you have 1 redraw to the nuts, whereas villain has no outs to improve. 1 out &gt; 0 outs.

Still, having put the villain on aa23, I just don't think you're pot committed and you can fold safely to the flop bet.

[Habib Marwan]

lol MP opens and you put him on aa23