check raising a paired board as bb defense

[Wynton]

I'm just curious how standard a play this is, or should be.

In other words, say that a middle of the road TAG open-raises from the button. You call, without an Ace. Flop is T44.

Do you consider this a good time for check/raising the flop? How often do you think a TAG opponent will fold by the turn?

[jfresh]

i've been wondering this as well. i almost 100% just give it up, especially without an ace. i guess the play is based on the button's stealing % and aggressiveness, but the lower the steal %, the more likely he is to have a hand, but the more lag he is, the more likely he is to raise with air.

i think without a strong read its better to just give up these flops too. but i'd like to hear other opinions too.

also, is this a standard chkraise with an ace?

[sweetjazz]

Use reads: some TAGs will give up often here, some will push back with air. Some TAGs have a use stealing range, others have a tighter range. (In general, attack players with wider stealing ranges, as they will be more likely to have a hand that is too weak to go to SD UI. But be careful b/c a wide stealing range often is indicative of someone willing to make a play at the pot with a weak hand.)

To balance this, you should be raising with trips, a pair (using the other board card or in the hole) and good A high hands (for value).

[stigmata]

I just give these up also unless I have a little something else to back into... But maybe I need to think about doing this more?

[redrooski24]

Considering nobody folds K high on these boards, I almost never c/r air or even ace high on these boards.

[sweetjazz]

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Considering nobody folds K high on these boards, I almost never c/r ... ace high on these boards.

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[img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[Lurker4]

[ QUOTE ]
Considering nobody folds K high on these boards, I almost never c/r air or even ace high on these boards.

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They do, and will on a bad turn card. Your checkraise might not fold him out immediately, but does buy you fold equity on some turn cards. And most players likely fold at least 98 and below on the flop.

I think its important to at least play back without a pair/strong Ace at least a small % of the time against players with high ASBs, especially with hands with strong enough backdoor/pair draws to call a 3-bet.

Also, check/call and donkbet/folding any turn, while looking kind of fishy, may be a less expensive alternative, as many may not play back at you with air even though its likely you don't have anything either.