An Inconvient Truth -- Exaggeration by Gore?

[TStoneMBD]

if youve seen this movie youd know how strongly al gore feels about global warming. he basically states that if something isnt done the planet is [censored].

so this begs the question, is this what al gore really believes or does he use exaggeration to get something done?

there seems to be alot of debate over how much damage global warming will really do. i have no idea how much of this is propaganda and am relatively uncertain as to what the average scientific opinion is on the matter other than what is stated on wikipedia and other informational websites. of course, the mean of opinion seems to be distorted by political activists. gore claims that political opposition of global warming has tried to propagate through the media that scientists debate over the seriousness of global warming. likewise, it wouldnt surprise me if global warmining fundamentalists claim that global warming is more serious than it is to aid their cause. of course, if global warming fundamentals stretch the truth to get things done then the mere fact that they are doing this shows how serious they find the issue to be. i could be mistaken, but it doesnt seem like there would be many alterior motives for supporting global warming fundamentalists.

i dont really expect to get any insight as to how severe global warming is in this thread, but id like to hear what your thoughts are for why al gore is so dramatic about his cause. is he getting paid by global warming fundamentalists to exaggerate to extremes, is this what he truly believes or is he truly a die hard global warming fundamentalistic that is using exaggeration to get something done?

also, opinions as to whether you feel al gore is a stand up guy, a crook or just a moron are also welcomed.

tx

[ianlippert]

From NCDC:

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Data collected and averaged between the 850-300 mb levels (approximately 5000 to 30,000 feet above the surface) indicate that 1958-2005 global temperature trends in the middle troposphere are similar to trends in surface temperature; 0.12°C/decade for surface and 0.15°C/decade for mid-troposphere.

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So we are going to see an increase in global temperature of 1.5 degrees over the next century. Much lower than the 3-5 degrees that some studies have claimed. What effect this is going to have I cant really say, but I feel like the effect is going to be small enough and gradual enough that it really wont be that much of a problem.

I think the media has really blown this out of proportion. Now Global Warming is so ingrained in the general population that everything is due to global warming. OMG! LOTS OF HURRICANES! GLOBAL WARMING!!! Which just further promotes the alarmist view. I feel that we are going to run out of fossil fuels before global warming is a huge issue.

But hey I'm Canadian, so any sort of Global Warming is a good thing [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[John Feeney]

I had posted something, but decided I didn't want to bother with it here anymore.

[wacki]

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I had posted something, but decided I didn't want to bother with it here anymore.

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lol. I wish I could do the same but Tstone is a friend of mine.

Tstone this is the consensus on climate change:
http://www.logicalscience.com/consensus/consensus.htm

As you can see there are even coal and oil companies (BP, Shell, etc) that agree it's happening and it's very dangerous. The only reason global warming is even a debate is because companies like Exxon and Phillip Morris spend millions fighting global warming.

As for Al Gore, well I was actually very angry walking out of that movie because I feel he missed a lot of important concepts and focused on himself way to much. This should be obvious since he never once mentioned a scientists that wasn't his personal teacher. He failed to talk about ocean acidification. Carbonic acid could very easily kill off all forms of coral by 2060. And Gore only talked about a 20 foot rise in sea level. We are not talking about "just" a 20 foot rise in sea level we are talking about a very possible 80 feet rise. That would put the entire country of Bangladesh under water. Read this thread:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...e=0#Post7734295

And there are lots of other things to worry about that I'm not going to go into yet.

I wish I could remake that movie because I feel it lacked that much content. However, all of the mainstream scientists that commented on that movie the facts presented are correct. The only good news is that we aren't the ones that will be screwed. It's our childred and grandchildren that will pay the price. It takes time for the ocean to heat up and the ice to melt. But once you increase CO2 past a certain level, there is no going back.

[wacki]

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So we are going to see an increase in global temperature of 1.5 degrees over the next century. Much lower than the 3-5 degrees that some studies have claimed.

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I hope you realize that a 5 degree rise in temp equals an 80 foot increase in sea levels. And I hope you realize it takes a few centuries for temperature to reach equilibrium. So if "only" 1.5 degrees happens this century then the next century will be in a very very bad place. It takes time for ice to melt and water to heat up.

And please don't reference "some" models that is a strawman. Exxon funded lobbyists make up fake models just to "debunk" them. The only model that should be referenced is this one:

http://www.logicalscience.com/skepti...dont-work.html

Or the one that is on display at the IPCC.

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OMG! LOTS OF HURRICANES! GLOBAL WARMING!!!

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http://www.logicalscience.com/skeptic_arguments/SAL.htm

There is so much wrong with your post it's not worth addressing the rest of it.

[ianlippert]

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There is so much wrong with your post it's not worth addressing the rest of it.


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Probably, I dont know that much about it. But I dont really see anybody doing anything about it. Do you honestly believe people are willing to give up their way of life to reduce emissions? I dont think so. Global warming is here to stay, its probably more productive to create policy that is going to deal with the consequences than throwing money at an unsolvable problem.

[wacki]

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There is so much wrong with your post it's not worth addressing the rest of it.


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Probably, I dont know that much about it. But I dont really see anybody doing anything about it.

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You mean President Bush and Exxon are fighting tooth an nail to prevent other people from doing stuff about it.
http://tinyurl.co.uk/aei4


Other people are taking bold steps.
http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/science....ap/index.html

There are over 300 US governors that are leading the way.

IT's a massive job that will require the leadership of a president we don't have yet. A lot of people think the costs of fixing climate change are insignificant when compared to rising oil prices alone. Sorry, but money is not the issue. Heck getting rid of oil will save us the $2 a barrel military subsidy we already pay on each and every gallon of gasonline. Although there are some other factors, it basically boils down to the will of a president we don't have.

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Do you honestly believe people are willing to give up their way of life to reduce emissions? I dont think so.

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No, and they shouldn't have to. And do you really think climate change won't change their life anyway? I mean there are 175 million people in Bangladesh alone that will have to find a completely new country to live in if sea levels do rise 80 feet. And ocean acidification will not be friendly to the fishing business.

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Global warming is here to stay, its probably more productive to create policy that is going to deal with the consequences than throwing money at an unsolvable problem.

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I think you are absolutely wrong on this one:
http://www.logicalscience.com/technology/

And so does NASA's James Hansen and this guy:

http://smalley.rice.edu/

James hansen believes tackling the problem will only create a lot of high paying jobs just like Apollo did.

[Troy Smith]

I believe the problem will be solved if you give me $1M. Please write your check to...

[ianlippert]

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Other people are taking bold steps.
http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/science....ap/index.html



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So what you are saying is that there is money to be made if you scream about something loud enough?

Look, im not saying global warming isnt happening or that it wont effect anyone. I'm just saying that I think its blown out of proportion. Saying that the sea levels are going to rise 80 feet is pretty rediculous, but its alarmist stuff like this that sells.

Also making projections based on past trends is pretty pointless. For example increased CO2 is probably going to increase plant life on our planet which will slow down or halt the increase in CO2. There is so much that could possibly happen within the next 50 years that I dont think anyone can say they know for certain or that 'there is scientific consensus'.

[wacki]

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Saying that the sea levels are going to rise 80 feet is pretty rediculous

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You may think it's "rediculous" (sic), but I think people that makes comments like this without any data to back up their statements are retarded. This is especially true when said person has already made comments that are demonstrably false. Coral records clearly show that sea levels have been much higher than that before. If you have no data you should try a little more education and a lot less opinion. Start reading realclimate.org.

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So what you are saying is that there is money to be made if you scream about something loud enough?

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Last time I heard that comment it was in this movie:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0427944/

Sorry but climate scientists don't recieve a penny from alternative energy development. They don't want anymore money, they want you to fix the problem.