Psy. Of Poker & Inside Poker Mind, read which one first?

[Zachvdp]

Anybody who's read both of these books, which one would you suggest reading first.
Does one complement the other?
Which one improved your game the most?
Whats the best metal poker book?
Are they good for no limit?

[scorer]

Most on this board like inside the poker mind as it delas with tilt issues etc. However i believe they are both good books.

[ledfoot]

Read Inside the Poker Mind. It will help your all-around game.

[playersare]

inside the poker mind is not really applicable to no limit, though some concepts could possibly be interpolated from fixed limit games, I never tried to when I read it.

I thought psychology of poker was too verbose and drawn out for the subject matter overall, but there is certainly useful information in there. you probably would get more out of this one under your circumstances (I personally liked ITPM though).

neither book is perfect for NL because they were both written in 2000 when cash games were still primarily fixed limits. NLTAP is probably your best bet if you haven't read that already.

[scottro77]

By far, Inside the Poker Mind is the much more useful book.

I thought Psychology of Poker, although interesting in some parts, was a fairly dull waste of time.

77

[sandman-54]

I would suggest first reading The Psychology of Poker, especially if you feel you need help with controlling your emotions during play. The benchmarks for Loose/Tight and Aggressive/Passive players in your game can be avoided if you're mainly concerned with no-limit. I find myself preaching this text all the time, but it definely deserves it as it can give a less-than-very-experienced player the courage to do what is correct and the ability to understand and consider his opponents' motivations for playing.

Although I think that Inside the Poker Mind is aimed at filling the leaks in the play of a more experienced mid-limit hold'em player, I suggest you find time to read it cover to cover as well. His tilt essays will help you to identify even the most "subtle losses of judgement".

[Adman]

I've gotta say I really love the Psychology of poker. I think its a fantastic read but most people seem to dislike it from what I've read on the net. I don't understand why people assume that the books both address the same subject matter. They don't; they are very different books. Inside the poker mind is actually more of a strategy book for advanced players than a book about the psychology of poker. It contains numerous essays addressing various aspects of the game from playing short handed to playing against a maniac to playing AQ from early position. Psychology of poker really is about the thought processes and playing characteristics of the various types of opponents you will come across on the poker tables. It contains very little actual strategy- that is not its purpose.

[Captain R]

I just finished reading Inside the Poker Mind, and have to give it 2/5 stars. Yeah, I suppose the essay on tilt hasn't really been written about before, but any winning poker player has realized by now that the thing to focus on is how well you're playing instead of how your results are.

It seems like about 85% of the book I already knew, 5% I learned something from, and about 10% I just plain disagree with. If you were to follow all of Feeney's advice, you would be driving around in a Volvo and never involve yourself in anything even remotely dangerous. Huh? By that rationale, you should expend your poker bankroll in driving courses and wearing a hard hat everywhere your walk because that is the most +EV.

Other nuggests of "gold" from the book:
- Cold-calling raises with KJo is -EV. Wow, doesn't every other poker book on the planet state something like that? But Feeney likes to use the fancy term "self-weighting cold-calls".
- Playing too many hands makes you lose money.
- Going on tilt is caused by some deep-rooted psychological issues when your dad made fun of you when you were little. Huh? I think 95% of poker players out there go on tilt, and I think the cause is simple: you keep getting outdrawn by a bunch of idiots and as a result you lose pot after pot.
- Playing in tournaments takes less skill than live cash games. I don't even play in tournaments, but listen to any winning tournament player discuss strategy and you'll see it's way above what the average middle limit HE player has to think about. He claims thinking about stack sizes is an uninteresting strategic component compared to the more interesting things a live cash game player has to think about. Like what? Is there a juicier game next door?

The most annoying thing about this book though is the somewhat condescending tone of voice Feeney uses. I especially like how he goes over how he moved up from small limits to middle limits.

I like most 2+2 books, but this one was a disappointment. Maybe I'm not the right audience for this book -- I'm a winning middle limit HE player already, so not much was really new to me.

I'm going to give this book to some low-limit playing friends and see what their opinions are.

[fraac]

[ QUOTE ]
Going on tilt is caused by some deep-rooted psychological issues when your dad made fun of you when you were little. Huh? I think 95% of poker players out there go on tilt, and I think the cause is simple: you keep getting outdrawn by a bunch of idiots and as a result you lose pot after pot.

[/ QUOTE ]
This has been discussed a lot. There are two kinds of tilt. One is explosive and reactive, the other lasts longer, is harder to fix (I found lsd worked for a few months) and is indeed usually due to bad parents. Many people crave losing. Fact.

[sethypooh21]

Even though I disagree with this assessment of ITPM (I thought it was *very* useful early in my poker life, whereas PoP seemed a little 'self-helpish' to be immediately useful, though I may revisit), I just wanted to say that there is nothing quite so fun as a righteously negative review, well done sir.