4/8 live: (10,10)

[Man of Means]

foxwoods 4/8
UTG is tight player, a little scared on the big streets
MP limp-reraiser is an idiot
Button is a generally loose passive older guy however before the flop he makes the comment "I've got position, let's see if I can get the cards"

Here we go:
UTG raises, MP coldcalls 2, Hero has 10[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]10[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and 3-bets(?), button coldcalls the three, UTG calls for 2 more, MP caps it, all call the cap obviously since that limp-reraise is a jopke

With the player in between and UTG having a fairly tight range (AA-99, AK, AQ, AJs) is it still good to 3-bet?

Flop (16 sb, 4 ppl)
7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
UTG and MP check, Hero bets, Button raises, UTG coldcalls, MP folds, Hero calls.

Based on button's comment about "position" I strongly suspect he's over-repping his hand, even with the flush draw hoping to take away the pot. Perhaps he is confusing this game with the NL he watched on TV.

Turn (11 bb, 3 ppl)
K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG checks, Hero...

At this point I have no idea why UTG is behaving this way with any legitimate UTG raising hand. If he has AK and is planning to checkraise, I want to check/fold. But based on his mein, I am not sure he would raise the turn with a King.

If he has something like QQ-TT (afraid of my pf 3bet), I may want to either bet and hope Button continues his antics or a 3rd option: get ridiculous and checkraise to rep the K to squeeze UTG out of the hand.

The other possible holding for UTG is a FD like AQs or AJs.

[sharpie]

I'd just 3 bet the flop for value. I think UTG is either making a loose peel with his AK/AQ because it's pretty and the pot's big, or he has a flush draw. I'd expect better pockets to usually put in more action, even from a tight player, although they are possible.

I'd donk the turn. You're usually ahead of button, and he'll often check through the scare card. Pray UTG has a flush draw or a hand like AQ or even 99.

[marchron]

Button gave a concise little speech preflop, but it was a speech. He either has a very big hand or trash, and since he raised the flop you can throw out "trash" unless it's something that hit the flop like 76.

I'm not terribly scared of UTG. The only thing he can have that worries me is KK or AK that feared your preflop three-bet; while unlikely it's possible, certainly AK more often than KK. He has 99-QQ a ton. If he has AQ or AJ he's a moron unless he has the nut flush draw.

I check/reevaluate. Betting again is going to wind up getting you clobbered most of the time.

If it goes bet/checkraise behind you, definitely fold.
If it goes bet/call, I would still fold; in that case UTG probably has QQ-JJ and is being stubborn, and regardless, Button could still have you whaled.
If it goes bet/fold, I'd call and check/call most rivers.
If Button checks behind, oh well; yeah, we just gave everybody a free card, but we're not a lock to still be ahead, anyway, so odds are we could use it just as much as, if not more than the other two.

[Buzz-cp]

this sounds weird, but i think button has AA/KK, sounds like sandbagging.

I think the flop is standard / wait for turn. Turn is tough. I think I check and see, because we could be trapped by UTG. He obv has overcards, or a bigger overpair that is not going to fold.

[tiltaholic]

MoM-

This is a tough one.
I'm not a huge fan of the pf 3-bet if he's one of those really tight passive guys. If he is, then he's not raising AK even utg - so he has JJ+ here, maybe even QQ+. If he's just normal tight, then I like the 3-bet.

My gut feeling on loose passive guy is a small-mid pair.

I'd call 2 more bb and go to showdown. I might even 3 bet the flop (and fold to a turn raise).

[Ignignokt]

If that speech is uncharacteristic of Button, you are playing for set value.

Check/fold flop.

[Buzz-cp]

igni, we can check/call 1 bet on flop for set

Buzz

[Ignignokt]

[ QUOTE ]
igni, we can check/call 1 bet on flop for set

Buzz

[/ QUOTE ]

Pot size, of course. Math is about the only viable factor here, though.

[Aaron W.]

[ QUOTE ]
UTG is tight player, a little scared on the big streets

[/ QUOTE ]

I might fold or coldcall, depending on the players behind me and the blinds. Given that you expect button to call, I think a coldcall would be much better. You're looking at a 5-6 handed pot with a pocket pair that might even hold up UI.

Tight player raising UTG is bad news and you're not doing well against his hand range (you gave AA-99, AK, AQ, AJs)

20%: AA-JJ = 24 hands
50%: AK/AQ/AJs = 36 hands
80%: 99 = 6 hands

[marchron]

[ QUOTE ]
Tight player raising UTG is bad news and you're not doing well against his hand range (you gave AA-99, AK, AQ, AJs)

20%: AA-JJ = 24 hands
50%: AK/AQ/AJs = 36 hands
80%: 99 = 6 hands

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm a little [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] by these percentages. What are you saying here?