NL100 FR : JJ vs a really awfull player with 200+ BB

jetsetboy · #1 10-18-2006, 02:05 PM

Vilain is a pure fish. He has been lucky so far. He is 40/8/0.4 over about 100 hands with a went to SD of 35%. He can fold to a C-bet but never fold preflop. To give you an example of how fishy he was :

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

UTG+1 ($191.37)
Hero ($178.83)
MP1 ($20.50)
MP2 ($48)
MP3 ($119.70)
CO ($52.95)
Button ($141.85)
SB ($132.62)
BB ($149.25)
UTG ($19)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.50.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $1, Hero raises to $5, 7 folds, UTG+1 calls $4.

Flop: ($11.50) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $8, UTG+1 calls $8.

Turn: ($27.50) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero checks.

River: ($27.50) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: $27.50

Results:
UTG+1 has 8c Qc (one pair, eights).
Hero has Ad Tc (high card, ace).
Outcome: UTG+1 wins $27.50.

(I usually don't raise ATo UTG+2 but I wanted to isolate).

So here is the hand :

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($217.27)
Hero ($333.03)
SB ($95.50)
BB ($115.85)
UTG ($97.50)
UTG+1 ($50.45)
UTG+2 ($122.30)
MP1 ($119.12)
MP2 ($149.30)
MP3 ($98.50)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.50.
UTG raises to $2, UTG+1 calls $2, UTG+2 calls $2, 1 fold, MP2 calls $2, 1 fold, CO calls $2, Hero raises to $15.5, 2 folds, UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, MP2 folds, CO calls $13.50.

Flop: ($40.50) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $28.5, CO calls $28.50.

Turn: ($97.50) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $50, CO calls $50.

River: ($197.50) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
CO checks, Hero ?

Should I value bet here ?

keikiwai · #2 10-18-2006, 02:10 PM

villain has less than pot left. it's more likely that he has a 5, 7, or 9 than a 3, so I would value push.

the oesd and gs the turn completed is more worrisome, since I'm sure 64 and 86 are in his range on the turn

i'm pretty sure you make money pushing the river, given your read though

monkeymaps · #3 10-18-2006, 02:12 PM

I would bet for value, bet more on turn and flop too

jetsetboy · #4 10-18-2006, 02:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would bet for value,

[/ QUOTE ]

Push ?

[ QUOTE ]
bet more on turn and flop too

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't want to feel commited on the turn and I don't like to play huge pots with JJ UI. Given the action preflop the pot seems huge for this hand on the flop. Was it so awfull to try to control the pot size ?

monkeymaps · #5 10-18-2006, 02:19 PM

I dont think anything about the hand was awfull just you went out of your way to tell us the villian is awfull i would hammer him more thats all.

Yes and bet for value means push.

bobman0330 · #6 10-18-2006, 02:21 PM

Easy push. And you shouldn't be worried about getting committed to the pot. As far as I'm concerned, the strength of your hand and the weakness of the opponent have already tied you on. What you need to worry about is tying the villain to the pot, which you need to do by betting more, probably on the turn.

ReptileHouse · #7 10-18-2006, 02:24 PM

I push here. He'll almost always pay off with any TP hand.

jetsetboy · #8 10-18-2006, 02:31 PM

Ok thanks all, that's what I thought when I checked behind the river and saw 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. I could have earned 1 BI more here... snif.

CharlieDontSurf · #9 10-18-2006, 02:55 PM

Raise pre-flop to $22-25

novel20 · #10 10-18-2006, 03:17 PM

Check is fine. You don't always suck out of river, and villain is dumb, but he does not always have a weak 2 pairs. If you always "value" bet by pushing all in on river, more than enough time villain would call with a set. And don't assume he is so dumb that he would never fold when the river paired up.