These old boys are loose but tricky

[MRBAA]

Regular stud high game on the commuter train, 1-5 spread, 1-10 on river. It's a four man game and we all know each other well. I've got a live AK heart draw against a loose player who likes to push with not alot (he knows I'm fairly tight and will sometimes fold) but who also respects me and won't generally push on later streets without a hand. He's capable of a naked bluff, though, if he thinks the time is right. Somewhat surprisingly, he's also capable of some fairly big laydowns for the big river bet. On fourth he makes it $3 with an eight in the door, I am the only caller. He makes it $3 again on fifth -- I call. On sixth he pairs his door with another 8, I catch my flush, giving me three hearts on board, including the K. He bets $5, I make it $10 and he calls.

On the river, he checks dark and I...

[Phat Mack]

The standard river check in the dark is two pair that thinks it's beat. Here it may be trips with a big kicker if he knows you have the flush. I go ahead and bet, but since I want to get called I don't bet $10, I put out the Ambiguous Five Dollar Continuation Milker (patent pending).

[MRBAA]

I read his $5 bet into my hearts on sixth, and his call of my raise, as almost certainly trips.

You are correct about the "milking $5 river raise" it's a staple in this game.

[Andy B]

I bet $10 and call a raise. He's not really going to fold trips there, is he?

[Phat Mack]

[ QUOTE ]
I bet $10 and call a raise. He's not really going to fold trips there, is he?

[/ QUOTE ]

At first, I was going to scold Andy for not attending MRBAA when he opined...

[ QUOTE ]
Somewhat surprisingly, he's also capable of some fairly big laydowns for the big river bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

..but I failed to consider the bet/call/check blind/raise play. What is missing is the crucial information as to whether these commuter lines still operate club cars.

[MRBAA]

Andy, I like your thinking but...

1) While I think he has trips, he may have only two pair. He would likely fold that.

2) He might fold trips for $10, but never for $5.

3) He is capable of bluff raising, so I will have to call a raise

[Andy B]

If he has two pair, I'm guessing he might be folding unimproved whether you bet $5 or $10. You know this guy and I don't. I can think of a couple of guys at Canterbury who will fold trips in the face of an apparent flush if they "know" that the other guy has it. The whole rest of the room will pay off, myself included. I'll guess that this guy will pay you off significantly more often than not. I agree that you have to pay off a raise, so you're laying 2:1. It's a lot more than 2:1 against him filling--enough more that I think it more than compensates for the times that he folds his trips unimproved.

[MRBAA]

Well, this is exactly the kind of problem I grapple with in trying to thump this game like I should. I bet the "call me" $5, he called with his trps and mhwg. Did I miss $5 more -- very likely. On the other hand I reduced by $5 the amount I lose when he does fill, raises, and I call. But on the other other hand, I reduced the amount I win when he misses, bluff raises and I call.