Playing stud hi B&M in sweden

[roggles]

I'm planning on playing 50/100 SEK (roughly $8/16) stud hi at the swedish (state-owned!) casino in the weekend, and I'm wondering if you have any general advice to give me.

I wonder what I can expect in terms of player quality. 50/100 is the lowest limit offered, btw. I guess this might impossible for you to answer.

Furthermore, the bring-in is very high. The ante is 10 and the bring-in is 25. How does this change the game? The rake is 5 %, with a maximum rake in a hand 100 SEK. That seems pretty high

[RustyBrooks]

The maximum rake IS high and that's the worst part. At the B&M casino I frequent, they charge a max of 2sb for rake at 3/6 but only 1sb at 6/12. I consider the 3/6 barely winnable.

That's a high bringin but the ante is no worse than full tilt's regular ante (.2bb). The high bringin I consider something of a problem. You should steal with relatively high frequency in the last few positions because you'll be wagering 50 to win 105, so you only need to win outright 1/3 times to make an automatic profit.

Every low limit live casino I've ever been to is largely populated by idiots with one or two decent players. However, even with relatively normal rake structure (which is generally more than online) there is relatively little profit to be had per hour - enough to support at most 2 players at the table winning 2bb/100. Work out how much money leaves the table per hour in rake, assuming 30 hands per hour, and you'll be shocked. You won't hit the rake cap very often (20bb in the pot...) so 5% of all the action goes to the house. Woof.

[roggles]

Yeah, the thing is the maximum rake does not depend on limits. So if you play 200/400 max rake is still 100, which is really good I guess.

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, the thing is the maximum rake does not depend on limits. So if you play 200/400 max rake is still 100, which is really good I guess.

[/ QUOTE ]
In the US, the maximum rake is generally $4-5, but it is 10%. At higher stakes they use a time charge, so effectively, is could reach about $10/hand at high stakes. In the US, atleast a $1 tip is customary.

The maximum of $16 generally works out higher. In general, continental casinos have a higher rake than those in North America or the British Isles.

[Andy B]

That's a very high rake. A $4 cap is pretty standard in the US, and some locales have $5 or $6 caps. The lower limits will frequently have a rake around 1 BB, which is very high, but people play very badly, so the games are usually pretty beatable. My understanding is that Europeans play even worse than Americans, so this should be a beatable game.

And you don't have to tip, right?

[RustyBrooks]

Oooh, no tipping would help. Also, if there's no jackpot drop.

I once contemplated a call in a holdem game where I was pretty sure my opponent had 3 aces (AA on the board) and I had KK. So there was 1 out that would lose me the pot but win me the (rather substantial) bad beat jackpot. Sure, one out sucks but the BBJ loser's part was $6000 and I only had to call $12 to see the next card so that's 500:1 "pot odds" assuming he has an A and a kicker that will play. I make my card 1 in 46 times so my expectation is that I'll win $6000 1 time and lose $12 45 times, for an average win of $118

So later I got to thinking and went over my records to see how many hands I'd played poker there on average, and thus how much I'd paid in jackpot drop. I usually play full tables so I'm putting 10 cents into every hand, and I'd played several hundred hours in that casino, so I'd already put in several hundred dollars into the kitty. I was playing to get my money back. I mean obviously it's a losing proposition but it really seemed like crap when I laid it out on paper.

[Andy B]

The jackpot drop is just part of your cost of doing business. I used to say that I wanted to win the jackpot so that I didn't have to play in jackpot games anymore. With the recent rake increase, Canterbury Park also made all poker games jackpot-eligible. The minimum jackpot for stud and Omaha is $1200, and occasionally it's that small or close to it. I don't think that people in a $30/60 stud/8 game are going to be all that excited about holding up their game to split a small jackpot. At $1200, the $50 table share isn't even a big bet, and the $600 loser's share might not even cover what he lost.

Another thing to not like about jackpots is that most casinos pay out something less than 100% of what they take in in jackpot drops. CP takes 10% off the top to cover "administrative expenses." An additional 15% goes towards promotional stuff--double jackpots, drawings, Aces always win, etc. Your room probably has something similar.

[roggles]

I know this doesn't strictly belong here, but does the rake become less troublesome if I play 20/20 PL omaha instead?

I'm just afraid of playing PL live, since I feel that I am not cool enough to pull off a lot of my plays in a convincing manner.

[Andy B]

If this is your first time playing live, you might want to consider something other than pot-limit.