25NL JJ CO

Schiester · #1 10-15-2007, 09:19 PM

$0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Villan is 24/12/1(160). Seems reasonable. He 3bet me pf from the button a few rounds back and I folded.

BB ($24.90)
UTG ($28.44)
Hero ($18.05)
CO ($31.53)
Button ($53.39)
SB ($28.45)

Preflop: Hero is MP with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero raises to $1, CO raises to $3.25, 3 folds, Hero calls $2.25.

Flop: ($6.85) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, CO checks.

Turn: ($6.85) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $2, Hero folds.

I figure his range has me killed by the turn.

Is anyone playing this hand differently? In this situation am I just playing JJ for set value or should I 4bet pf given this character is making a habit of this situation and perhaps his range is wider than JJ+,AK?

Nick C · #2 10-15-2007, 09:26 PM

You're not really deep-stacked enough to play for set value alone, so preflop is an awkward spot. I probably call with my jacks preflop though and see what the flop brings and what Villain wants to do. And if the flop brings me an overpair, I probably either check and call with the intention of making a decision on the turn or bet with the plan of shutting down if called.

As it is, that turn card sucks, and I'm also worried about a sandbagged AQ (and a scared AA), but I probably call that $2 bet and see what Villain wants to do on the river. I'm certainly not thrilled about the situation, though.

Edit: Er, actually, if Villain made a real bet on the flop, you'd already be in a position where ~ 1/2 your stack was in if you kept playing. Which makes my check-call with an overpair idea more questionable.

Mostly, it really is kind of an awkward spot. Preflop 3-bets frequently mean very strong hands at NL25, but your hand is pretty damn good too, so on a better flop I am tempted just to play for my ~70 BB stack.

oneeyejak · #3 10-15-2007, 09:29 PM

I don't think a b/f on the turn would have been out of line.

Mr_Pathetic · #4 10-15-2007, 09:38 PM

unless he is 3 betting you light then good play. If you think he will get AI on this flop with AK or he min three bets any PP and goes nuts when board pairs then maybe b3b flop but I doubt I would ever try it.

In the heat of the battle I would probably call this turn since it is so cheap even though I know he will fire river and I won't be able to call and I'm probably way behind unless his range is wide.

SemiteStoned · #5 10-15-2007, 09:44 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think a b/f on the turn would have been out of line.

[/ QUOTE ]

Betting the turn is interesting.

However, repping AK here or a Q for that matter accomplishes nothing. AA and AK obv. call, and AQ and KK raises. And the only hand that he folds is TT and we are ahead of that anyways. And if we are goign to try and rep a Q, this is not the manner to do it in. As a c/r would be much more effective at getting folds.

Really the only thing that JJ accomplishes is that it allows him to not be able to bluff us off the winner, as he folds all his garbage hands and doesn't get the chance to bluff with them.

I like a c/f on the turn as played. Sometimes a c/r.

oneeyejak · #6 10-15-2007, 10:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Really the only thing that JJ accomplishes is that it allows him to not be able to bluff us off the winner, as he folds all his garbage hands and doesn't get the chance to bluff with them.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is about all a guy would expect to accomplish with a turn b/f.

I guess it just seems a little passive for my taste as played. But that works for some.

Schiester · #7 10-15-2007, 10:11 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Really the only thing that JJ accomplishes is that it allows him to not be able to bluff us off the winner, as he folds all his garbage hands and doesn't get the chance to bluff with them.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is about all a guy would expect to accomplish with a turn b/f.

I guess it just seems a little passive for my taste as played. But that works for some.

[/ QUOTE ]

I see what you're getting at but I don't beat anything in this guys (supposed) pf3betting range by the turn.

What I wonder is how I push him of a bluff cheaply if this is him making a squeeze play.

Givn this advice I'm between folding and calling turn... However, because I'm short I'm not going to get value if the J does hit. I'm only going to get to SD if he's bluffing and gives it up.