FTP 6max $22 rebuy-BvB battle, turn flush-->fold river?

[swede554]

6-max $20 rebuy on Tilt. First hand back after the 1st break. Avg. stack around 8k. Blinds 50/100.

I got moved to the table approx. two rounds prior to the break, and thus far the SB had been quite. I doubled up a shorty right before the break w/ TT<AJ.

SB-15k
Hero-7.5k

Folded to SB who min-raises. Hero call in the BB with 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

Flop(400) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

SB checks, Hero bets 200, SB calls.

Turn(800) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

SB checks, Hero bets 400, SB c/r to 800,
Hero 3-bets to 2200, SB calls.

River(5200) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

SB shoves, Hero folds.

Thoughts?

[erc007]

The only thing that bothers me (other than the call pre) is why didn't SB want to get it in on the turn? Obv slowplaying a boat is std, but most of the hands that u 3-bet with will call if he 4-bets. Seems like a little bit of a risk b/c another heart might make it tougher for him to get full value from a Q. It almost seems like he got so excited that he has trip Q's that he almost forgot about the 3-flush. The stop-and-go might indicate that he isn't giving u credit for the flush?

Are u folding b/c u think he has a bigger flush or do u think he has a boat? And did u consider shoving the turn?

[swede554]

Calling pre is questionable, but effective stacks are 75bb's, I got position, and I'm getting 3-1 to call so let's ignore that for now. Shoving the turn seems a bit akward because it would be a huge overbet, and I wanted to give SB room to 4-bet jam thinking he had FE. If he moves in on the turn, I'm calling btw.

[ QUOTE ]
It almost seems like he got so excited that he has trip Q's that he almost forgot about the 3-flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seems unlikely, I'd like to give my opponents credit for at least being able to read the board. This is such a strange line on his part,I'm not sure what he plays like this that I'm beating unless it's a pure bluff, but this is a bluff such a small % of the time given my 3-bet on the turn.

[erc007]

[ QUOTE ]
Calling pre is questionable, but effective stacks are 75bb's, I got position, and I'm getting 3-1 to call so let's ignore that for now. Shoving the turn seems a bit akward because it would be a huge overbet, and I wanted to give SB room to 4-bet jam thinking he had FE. If he moves in on the turn, I'm calling btw.

It almost seems like he got so excited that he has trip Q's that he almost forgot about the 3-flush.

Seems unlikely, I'd like to give my opponents credit for at least being able to read the board. This is such a strange line on his part,I'm not sure what he plays like this that I'm beating unless it's a pure bluff, but this is a bluff such a small % of the time given my 3-bet on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree that shoving the turn is an overbet, but he has to call with QxXh...and i'm not saying that he didn't/couldn't read the board, i'm just saying that this is HU...and he has a big hand, so he might not give u credit for a flush. If he's good, he might read your overbet as a semi-bluff and call with any Q or J...

[bucktotal]

why did you bet t400 on the turn.

i'd make it t600-t700 depending on what i think he'd call... then if he minraised to t1200 or whatever, i feel somewhat comfortable pushing. i dont think you will get much more value out of many worse hands on this board anyway and you're hand is pretty vulnerable still.

your small turn bet and 3-bet makes this awkward and his river push for pot is too big to read (for me). i mean... he could have any Ahxh, QJ, 66. maybe he's crazy enough to turn Qx or worse into a bluff since you're not really calling with less than a Q yourself (as made obv in this spot).

i dont mind the lay down here, but i think you're turn play messed this pot up. i'd even prefer a check on the turn and call any river or just call the minbet and call a small river?... i dunno, hard to say without a better read.

sry for the unclear ramble. but something feels weird.

[Sherman]

I could see a lot of trip queen hands (that aren't QJ) making (a retarded) shove on the river.

If we are getting 2:1 or better I'd call.

[erc007]

[ QUOTE ]
... but something feels weird.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that this is significant b/c people tend to play their huge hands in really predictable/transparent ways (ie. too slow, or too fast...etc.)

Even tho the river shove looks like a huge bet, it's only pot-size. I don't see how you would have called a turn 4-bet but fold on a non-heart river. You only have to be good 33% of the time here to call.

[swede554]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't see how you would have called a turn 4-bet but fold on a non-heart river. You only have to be good 33% of the time here to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

I actually called. Figured I'd get better responses if I said I folded. SB tabled 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Just wanted to get some opinions on whether I could've played this better on the turn and river.

[erc007]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't see how you would have called a turn 4-bet but fold on a non-heart river. You only have to be good 33% of the time here to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

I actually called. Figured I'd get better responses if I said I folded. SB tabled 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Just wanted to get some opinions on whether I could've played this better on the turn and river.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL...good post tho andy.

[registrar]

Don't three-bet the turn.