NL10 TPTK oop, potential flush draw, check anyway?

[WantToLearn]

Ok, I have TPTK and the flop brings 2 suited cards. My normal line here is bet-bet-bet against unknown players (as long as the flush doesn´t come and/or there is no extrem agression of villains), but in this case I know the two main villains. It´s hard to get big bets out of these guys when they are beat, but they can fold.
I am looking for comments on my line.
Thank you!

<u>Reads:</u>
MP1 - he is a tight ABC multitabler. He does not have a record of tricky play.
Button - this one is known to err on the side of cautiousness when the bets get big


Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.05/$0.10 Blinds - 9 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $13.05
BB: $8.55
Hero (UTG): $11.85
UTG+1: $1.20
MP1: $13.80
MP2: $2.60
MP3: $5.70
CO: $18.35
BTN: $8.30

Preflop: Hero is dealt K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (9 Players)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $0.60</font>, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls $0.60, MP2 calls $0.60, 2 folds, BTN calls $0.60, 2 folds

<font color="blue"> They have seen me making preflop raises of that size before. </font>

Flop: ($2.55) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 Players)
Hero checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, BTN checks

<font color="blue"> Nice flop, but MP1 and Button are not the customers I wanted.

Ok, I sure see the possible flush draw. Problem is, MP1 cold-calling my preflop raise means that he is set-mining most of the time. That is, more often than not, he either has nothing to pay for, or has me beat. Button is also not going to call-call-call with a worse King. So, if I get callers here, I feel like I have to check the turn anyway, even if it´s a blank. So why not check now, bet later? Against a villain who wants to play (the big stacks) I feel like I have to give one free card anyway.

Even more, I do not expect MP1 to slowplay, say, a set. MP2 is quite likely to bet any kindof-flop-connected hand if checked to, given his stack size and the common NL10-manners. Up to a certain degree, they are both defining their hands should they check behind.</font>

Turn: ($2.55) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 Players)
Hero checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, <font color="red">BTN bets $1.00</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $4.00</font>, 2 folds, BTN calls $3.00

<font color="blue"> Ok, it´s three of them, but is this worth a try anyway? </font>

River: ($10.55) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

Pot Size: $10.55 ($0.50 Rake)

[ranka]

[ QUOTE ]

Nice flop, but MP1 and Button are not the customers I wanted.


[/ QUOTE ]
It is not nice flop! It is very dangerous flop - flush + straight draw on the board. You have to bet this flop.

[ QUOTE ]

Ok, I sure see the possible flush draw. Problem is, MP1 cold-calling my preflop raise means that he is set-mining most of the time.


[/ QUOTE ]
And again one more reason to bet - do figure out where you are standing.

As played I think the turn check-raise is good. Villain just calls and probably he have medium pocket pair or weak king.

I would bet 3-4$ on the river.

[Mike Kelley]

I think you might as well shove the river since button only has about a 1/3 pot size bet left in his stack.

[zyrrth]

bet flop, see what happens

[SABR42]

WTF, just bet the flop.

If the middle guys are nits having them fold is FINE, because if they have some random pocket pair, you're not getting a cent out of them anyway.

[WantToLearn]

[ QUOTE ]
If the middle guys are nits having them fold is FINE, because if they have some random pocket pair, you're not getting a cent out of them anyway.

[/ QUOTE ]

I really have to learn a lot.
Now that I have been shown, I can see how very obvious that is.
Thanks!

[MadMike]

If you're only planning on betting 2 streets, it's better that one of them is the flop. Your planning on giving a free card- better to give the free card on the turn when it's probably not going to be 4-way than on the flop.

BTW- misapplying concepts (like planning out how the turn and river will play out from the flop, pot control, varying your line based on opponents) is the first step to learning how to apply them correctly. This hand was misplayed but at least you're thinking about the right things.

[threads13]

I don't like checking this flop in a decent sized pot with this many players. However, with the tight straightforward players in there you shouldn't have to bet much to figure out what is going on. So, bet about 1.5 or so and hope the short stack player gets involved.

The turn becomes interesting if one of the tight players call.