Limp-Reraise (or threat of it) to manipulate pot size?

[MadMike]

Does anyone use this much at NL100 and lower? To keep a favorable implied odds (or minimize reverse implied odds) postflop it would be good to keep the pot small preflop with certain hands, but large with others. Two examples: for mid-high SC's from EMP, an open-raise builds a larger than optimum pot on the flop, but an open-limp invites a raise behind from a positionally aware player (I do this all the time). Alternatively an open raise from EMP with AK, and a cold-caller or two behind, builds a pot that is kind of awkward- if you c-bet and get called or raised then you are OOP with a good but not great hand in a pot where you've got a fair amount behind and stand to lose your stack if you are up against a better hand, but probably not win a stack from a worse hand.

I'm wondering if LLRing on a semi-regular basis might be a way to get better control over these situations. What I'm thinking is that a LRR with strong top-pair hands like AK would allow me to have a much bigger pot on the flop, probably HU, and prevent anyone from profitably floating and bluffing the turn with a weaker hand. Also, if I hit I'm happy to play for stacks here since I've not got as much behind.

If I'm regularly LRRing with hands like AK, AQs and maybe a few other- then I might be able to limp in with slower developing hands like 87s where I want to play with a lot behind after the flop- since players behind can't automatically assume my overlimp or open limp is with a weak hand and raise me without fear of a LRR.

Obviously I loose immediate value from AK,AQs and other hand like this by limping if no one raises behind- so does the ability to manipulate pot size and the postflop flow outweigh the equity lost by not raiseing preflop?

Haven't seen too much discussion about this- anyone have thoughts?

[Jeff76]

I l/r and minraise/4bet with hands like AK and AQ AS WELL as AA/KK for the reasons that you mention.

I don't do this every time, but enough so that I can keep people from exploiting my limping range and sometimes build bigger pots with my top pair/overpair hands.

Another benifit to this is that often otherwise solid players do not deal with l/r well

[Albert Moulton]

Yes, Limp-Reraise to manipulate pot size especially when stacks are such, and the table is such that a 4bb raise will result in one or two callers and an SPR of about 13. That way if there is no raise/re-raise, the SPR is probably 17-20+, but if there is a raise/re-raise, you're playing for an SPR of 4-7 (better for playing TP and overpairs with less commitment problems).

Also, depending on stack sizes, sometimes its nice to min-raise with small pairs, for example, so that when you get 3 or 4 limpers, the pot is twice as big as it would be otherwise. If you ever do that, then occaisionally you need to min-raise with AK/AA/KK/QQ and reraise to avoid being too obvious.

I play live, and open minraising is often treated more like a straddle than anything else.

So, back to the OP, yes. And in certain situations with 200bb stack sizes, min-raising in EP is like limping. Why not raise? Because min-raising often keeps the pot small enough to call a reraise profitably for set value. But a 4 bb or 5bb raise followed by a caller or two plus a big reraise often results in improper implied odds to play OOP for a set.

A lot of guys pooh-pooh min-raising, but there's actually a little section in NLHETAP about when it might be appropriate. If you do it, however, you need to occasionally do it with a big hand too.

[machine]

What is SPR guys is that from the new no limit book? is it a complex thing that i couldnt understand from a simple explanation? or should i just read the book? Sorry guys just havent finished NLHTAP yet :P and wanna get involved with some of these hand disscussions

[threads13]

I use it quite a bit as has been illustrated before me. I also think an occasionally l/rr semi-bluff has its merits.