Turn Decision

Six_of_One · #1 07-09-2007, 06:06 PM

20/40 at Commerce, Sunday afternoon. Pretty good game.

Villain in this hand is an extremely weird, bad player. He loves to take a long time when it's his turn, looking back at his cards several times, hemming and hawing before finally taking action. He plays maybe 60% of his hands, and whether he calls or raises pre-flop seems to be based on his mood rather than on his cards. He's not overly aggressive post-flop, but I have seen him raise the flop on draws a couple of times.

Anyway, the hand: someone limps in MP, CO raises. Villain calls from the button, and I 3bet J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] from the BB. Everyone calls.

Flop: 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I bet, MP folds, CO calls looking frustrated, villain raises. I 3bet...CO had put in one bet to call without realizing I raised again, and when he realized he put another bet in, shaking his head now. Villain caps it (thinks for a while, says "Hmm, I guess I'll cap it"), and we all call.

Turn: 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I bet, CO folds, villain raises (he acted quickly this time, FWIW).

Was betting the turn a mistake? And what do I do now?

that_pope · #2 07-09-2007, 06:24 PM

I don't think betting the turn is a mistake because a lot of bad players will cap the flop with a draw, and giving free cards is -EV. Since you described him as such a bad player, you can't give him credit for a better hand yet. He might simply love his A8.

Call turn, hope to hit a 6 or J, and call most rivers that isn't the 5 of hearts.

I feel the pot is big enough that we are showdown bound.

andyfox · #3 07-09-2007, 06:25 PM

If villain is as strange a player as you say, I dont' see how you can lay down here. One would think he's got a pocket pair somewhere between 6s and tens, but who knows. I'd call down.

As for the river bet, it sandwiched the A-Q or whatever two unimproved high cards between you and the wierdo, so it's OK in my book.

Maliant · #4 07-09-2007, 06:33 PM

I don't mind how you've played it, based on speech and image I guess I'd call down.

n.s. · #5 07-09-2007, 08:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Villain caps it (thinks for a while, says "Hmm, I guess I'll cap it"), and we all call.

[/ QUOTE ]

If villain is a bad player, this sort of speech ("oh I hate my hand so much now, but <sigh> I guess I should raise it") is usually the nuts. When the 6 pairs on the turn, I'd be really tempted to check-call it (CO clearly has overcards and will probably not overcall) since we have to call a raise to draw to our boat. I'd probably still call one more on the river (and hope he's fallen in love with his 78) because the pot is so big.

Maliant · #6 07-09-2007, 10:06 PM

I think his speech is indicative of a draw.

Six_of_One · #7 07-10-2007, 12:03 AM

Maybe this wasn't the best hand to post, but anyway, here's what happened:

After villain raised on the turn, I called, and called again on the river (a King). He turned over 69o for the winner.

Maliant · #8 07-10-2007, 01:06 AM

I guess I was right for once [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

onegymrat · #9 07-10-2007, 10:16 AM

I would be torn between betting (if I felt villain was looking for a free card) and check-raising (if I was confident he was going to bet). I wasn't there so I can't tell you exactly. What Andy said was the best, that with the description you gave, it's certainly worth the call down.