Live 15/30 Key flop decision...

[Garland]

Location: Artichoke Joes in San Bruno, CA
Stakes: $15/$30 2 chip small blind, 5 bet cap.
Players: Loose aggressive. 9-handed. Fantastic game, not overly tricky. Will need cards to hold up to win. Opponents are fairly readable. **** of 5 game.

Principal Players:
UTG – Young Asian who is running very hot. Has 4 racks of chips in front of him (but I’m unsure of how much he bought in for). Very loose aggressive pre-flop. Reasonable post-flop play. Makes occasional moves, but generally has something when he puts money in post flop.

UTG+1 – A tighter unshaven young guy. He is tighter than UTG. I’d say he is somewhere in the middle between me and UTG in terms of looseness pre-flop. Has been attempting to isolate 3-bet UTG a lot pre-flop, although he has cold-called a lot of raises too.

HJ – I’ve just moved from must-move, but I’ve played against a lot of them already (because they must-moved first), and the table already knows my image. Not too much into second level because a lot of them play their own cards.

BB – Total lagtard in BB. Middle aged fellow who always wears a beret. Let’s face it, if he sees two broadway cards, no amount of bets is keeping him from seeing the flop. He is short-stacked.

Preflop action: (1.67 small bets) UTG raises, UTG+1 3-clowns, I’m in HJ and 4-bet with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], folds to BB who calls, UTG caps, we all call.

Flop action: (20.67 small bets, 4 players): A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. UTG bets, UTG+1 pauses, and calls, I raise, BB 3-bets and is all-in [I give little respect to this 3-bet], UTG 4-bets, UTG+1 folds, I ???

All comments appreciated. Results forthcoming.

Garland

[sharpie]

Start calling down.

[cowboy billy]

well, folding is just not an option with a pot this huge and I can't see much benefit in a raise, so I

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Start calling down.

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[Joe Tall]

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Stakes: $15/$30 2 chip small blind, 5 bet cap.

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Chris Daddy Cool said that all California games were 4-bet cap. I knew I was asking for a reason. Is AJs under some grandfather clause?

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Players: Loose aggressive. 9-handed. Fantastic game, not overly tricky. Will need cards to hold up to win. Opponents are fairly readable. **** of 5 game.


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CDC also said that all NoCal games are described as "Asian", is this just a long version? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

As for the hand, start calling down.

[chillrob]

I know I have played in at least one place in CA that had a five bet cap, I believe two places. I have been to AJs among as well as maybe 15 other places in CA, I believe it was one of the 5-bet places.

Rob

[HOWMANY]

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Stakes: $15/$30 2 chip small blind, 5 bet cap.

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Chris Daddy Cool said that all California games were 4-bet cap. I knew I was asking for a reason. Is AJs under some grandfather clause?

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Players: Loose aggressive. 9-handed. Fantastic game, not overly tricky. Will need cards to hold up to win. Opponents are fairly readable. **** of 5 game.


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CDC also said that all NoCal games are described as "Asian", is this just a long version? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

As for the hand, start calling down.

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Viejas has 5bet cap on 15/30+ but 4 bets on 8/16 and lower. Yes that's retarded but that's the way it is for whatever reason.

As for the hand, like everyone else says, call down and lose a lot but win sometimes because the pot is real big.

[jfk]

Garland and I had different reads on this hand and different thoughts on the tendencies of the two villains.

UTG had raised any flop coming from his right when he had any pair or any draw. This included ISDs without additional outs, bottom pairs, etc. He four bet some flops and then checked down to the river. He was playing more than half his hands and liberally cold calling raises. He was a thinking LAG who was running white hot. He had the sense not to pay off or overplay rivers in which he knew he was behind and he maxed out value when he he played trash and connected (like 3,5 and Q,3).

The two players were also playing out of the same bankroll.

I can't say that their play was deliberately coordinated by prearrangement but the way many hands worked meant that the villain UTG here was going to raise the majority of flops. Being that both were lagging it up, this put players behind to tough decisions.

I was giving a little more credit to the BB's flop play and less credit to UTG, but BB was buying in for $200 a pop so a lot of his play was predicated on his stack size.

During play, the BB said, "I have a set of queens".

The two were loose to the point where Garland's range could've been wider than standard here. It wouldn't have been completely out of line to four bet with AJs+ or 99+ here because UTG +1 was liberally isolating and Garland was being afforded an enormous amount of respect.

Also, I didn't see this game as all that good vis a vis typical conditions there. It couldn't be called tough, but it wasn't anywhere near as loose and passive as is standard. I'd give it maybe 2 1/2 stars out of five. The quality of the players at the table was significantly higher than the mean. The aggressiveness was much higher than I remember it there in quite some time. It played like it was 2004.

With the benefit of a day's worth of consideration (and knowing how the hand turned out), I'd want to show down any ace here. UTG +1 was in a tough spot with Garland behind him as he (correctly) put Garland on a very narrow range.

[golferbrent]

I like a call here as you are closing the action. Wait and see what develops on the turn here. If you catch safe on the turn then you may want to put in a raise!! UTG could easily be making a play to ISO the all-in player and as such I put less merit in the strength of his hand. However, he clearly has a piece of the board or a flush draw. He isn't going to go nuts with a hand he is destined to show down against the all-in player.

I would raise all safe cards on the turn, with safe being defined as non-broadway--non-spade cards!

[remi983]

depending on the player, i'd go ahead and cap it on the flop. this will in all likelyhood get you to 5th street w/out a turn bet, and oftentimes will induce bluffs/innappropriate value bets from villian on the river; plus, if you're behind, your saving the big bet on 4th street. if you're ahead on the flop you could be losing a bet/giving free card on turn, but this is made up for by the bluffs/innappropriate value bets on the end.

alternatively, you could cap the flop and then bet the turn. then check behind when checked to on the river. this way no free card is given. a lot of the reasoning behind the first approach applies. since the pot is fairly large, this line might be better.

i think either of these are better than calling down. you can get to showdown cheaper. also, it helps metagame- once ppl see this, they will give you more action when you cap w/ ur monsters

[swope]

I play the 15-30 at AJ's 3-6 nights a week. UTG = flush draw betting his rush/raising for a free card 80% of the time, AQ/A7 or a set the other 15%, 5% he has AX and is trying to make what he perceives as everyone elses flush draw expensive.

TPTK shouldnt be folded here IMO, just call it down unless runner runner spades hit, and even then Im seriously considering calling down HU because of the volume of chips in the side pot.