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#1
05-20-2007, 08:00 AM
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Random situation
3 handed live game where you are allowed to straddle on the button. The player that is in the small blind on my button/straddle is the fish. The player in the BB is very good.
The fish regularly calls the raise in the sb giving the good player infinite:1 to come into the pot. The fish will then check pretty much any time he doesn't flop a pair. This leaves the good player with a 24 chip pot that he can and probably should try to steal 100% of the time for the low price of only 4 chips. What is our best course of action to foil his plans? At the time I folded almost every time but now I'm thinking that it might actually be worth raising regardless of my hand quite often because he should be folding a decent amount to my turn bet after being forced to peel the flop. 
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#2
05-20-2007, 09:03 AM
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Re: Random situation
Yeah that straddle dynamic was really weird and not sure what we should have been doing. I will say I preferred when you were on my right and fish was on my left, it seemed tougher when he moved seats. Also I didn't beat you in a heads up pot once in 4 hours to my recollection (did win that huge pot with straight vs your 2 pr vs his flush draw though!).
-DeathDonkey
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#3
05-20-2007, 10:08 AM
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Re: Random situation
[ QUOTE ]
What is our best course of action to foil his plans? At the time I folded almost every time but now I'm thinking that it might actually be worth raising regardless of my hand quite often because he should be folding a decent amount to my turn bet after being forced to peel the flop. [/ QUOTE ] So, 'very good player' figures out what you're doing after 15 minutes and starts check-raising your turn bet regardless of his hand. Solution: Don't play 3-ways in this situation unless you're the guy in the BB?
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#4
05-20-2007, 12:13 PM
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Re: Random situation
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] What is our best course of action to foil his plans? At the time I folded almost every time but now I'm thinking that it might actually be worth raising regardless of my hand quite often because he should be folding a decent amount to my turn bet after being forced to peel the flop. [/ QUOTE ] So, 'very good player' figures out what you're doing after 15 minutes and starts check-raising your turn bet regardless of his hand. Solution: Don't play 3-ways in this situation unless you're the guy in the BB? [/ QUOTE ] HB -- That's drastic. Seems very bad to leave a 3-handed game with a significantly live one. You have position and his average hand isn't (much) better than yours. If all the action including the flop bet is just quacking, then treat it accordingly and raise with your top 85% or 90% of hands or whatever. A consequence of that is that, against a good player, you'll need to bet/3bet the turn with top or second pair quite a bit, but if you can handle the swings the game should be well worth playing. --Nate
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#5
05-20-2007, 07:14 PM
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Re: Random situation
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] What is our best course of action to foil his plans? At the time I folded almost every time but now I'm thinking that it might actually be worth raising regardless of my hand quite often because he should be folding a decent amount to my turn bet after being forced to peel the flop. [/ QUOTE ] So, 'very good player' figures out what you're doing after 15 minutes and starts check-raising your turn bet regardless of his hand. Solution: Don't play 3-ways in this situation unless you're the guy in the BB? [/ QUOTE ] HB -- That's drastic. Seems very bad to leave a 3-handed game with a significantly live one. You have position and his average hand isn't (much) better than yours. If all the action including the flop bet is just quacking, then treat it accordingly and raise with your top 85% or 90% of hands or whatever. A consequence of that is that, against a good player, you'll need to bet/3bet the turn with top or second pair quite a bit, but if you can handle the swings the game should be well worth playing. --Nate [/ QUOTE ] A 3-handed game is uber fast. OP's top 85% of hands can be utter garbage and in a short space of time he can burn thru a whole bunch raising with them. Bet or 3-bet with top or second pair? Where is he going to find such strong hands every minute in a fast 3 handed game? He's going to have to be 3-betting with King high if he's lucky enough to get a King. To me the main problem here is that BB is a very good player who is on live one's left and that gives him a significant advantage. He gets to bet everytime SB checks (which he is going to do almost always) leaving OP wondering what to do. OP is wondering what to do because he's not getting any hands to confidently raise BB with and now he wonders if he should raise with anything because he knows that BB is robbing him. So he comes up with a plan that BB will recognize and be able to counter. Why put up with that? If BB was average that's another thing but since he's good I don't think that OP's initial thoughts on how to handle the situation is going to work either. Time to pack it in and wait until tomorrow, imo.
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#6
05-20-2007, 07:40 PM
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Re: Random situation
[ QUOTE ]
Don't play 3-ways in this situation unless you're the guy in the BB? [/ QUOTE ] Howard, You just said you'd rather be out of position rather than in position.
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#7
05-20-2007, 08:30 PM
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Re: Random situation
Disclaimer: I'm not an expert in short-handed.
It seems to me that in a hand where SB checks and BB bets, you should go ahead and raise with any pair, any 8+ out draw, any gutshot with one overcard, and any hand with two overcards to the flop that includes a K or A.
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#8
05-20-2007, 08:45 PM
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Re: Random situation
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Don't play 3-ways in this situation unless you're the guy in the BB? [/ QUOTE ] Howard, You just said you'd rather be out of position rather than in position. [/ QUOTE ] The best position in this game is to the left of the SB player as he is described especially since BB is the way HE is described.
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#9
05-20-2007, 08:49 PM
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Re: Random situation
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Don't play 3-ways in this situation unless you're the guy in the BB? [/ QUOTE ] Howard, You just said you'd rather be out of position rather than in position. [/ QUOTE ] The best position in this game is to the left of the SB player as he is described especially since BB is the way HE is described. [/ QUOTE ] You act like there's absolutely zero defense to the BB simply playing game theory at you, out of position, for 3-4 bets per hand preflop. C'mon.
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#10
05-20-2007, 09:05 PM
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Re: Random situation
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Don't play 3-ways in this situation unless you're the guy in the BB? [/ QUOTE ] Howard, You just said you'd rather be out of position rather than in position. [/ QUOTE ] The best position in this game is to the left of the SB player as he is described especially since BB is the way HE is described. [/ QUOTE ] You act like there's absolutely zero defense to the BB simply playing game theory at you, out of position, for 3-4 bets per hand preflop. C'mon. [/ QUOTE ] Ok, fair enough. There isn't zero defense certainly but we must take into account the reason OP made his post which is that he was apparently having all sorts of problems in this game, most of them seemingly post-flop. I've sometimes found myself in this spot and I say to myself: 'Self, your buddy on your right is getting the best of this. You should go home.' So I go home. Maybe that's weak but I don't think so. Lower BB's skill level and I sit there all night.
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