Rebuy and Addon Hypothetical

[THAY3R]

Last hand before the addon(typical Stars 1R + 1A), and you have 100 chips left UTG(Blinds 50/100). You are dealt AA. What do you do?

[THAY3R]

FWIW I think this is a clear fold, but I'm not sure the limit on my stack size is before I don't fold. I'm thinking if I have 400 I'm shoving.



Thoughts?

[THAY3R]

Also, in case you guys don't thoroughly understand what I mean :

If you call with AA and lose, you are out of the tourney. If you fold you can addon for 2k more.

[SkyyCaptain]

Personally I hate to rebuy, I'd limp, and hope to get several callers on the chances I'd trip, or quad up. Sometimes more. You're UTG so your limp will likely bring in others. You're looking at a pot of 300 almost certainly. and You might pick up limpers. That coupled with the fact that your odds of survival go down by the increased number of limpers means that you have a bigger chance of jumping up by a lot or busting.

Personally I like to avoid rebuying since if I rebuy 0 times I can play twice as many tourney's. Generally I feel I'm good enough to survive the rebuy phase, and if I'm not it wasn't my day. Its my thing. Anyways My pref would be to shove it and/or bust.

[WarDekar]

This is an obvious fold with 100 chips left. I'm not sure where the cut off should be either, though. I think it's probably in the 4-600 range like you think, to where doubling would actually mean something.

[shaundeeb]

I agree with 400-500 being min to shove here. I wonder what amounts we should use for weaker hands. It should be sort off treated like a sat where you shouldn't take a flip at end of break for all your chips pre addon etc.

[LearnedfromTV]

If you got the same number of chips for an addon as the initial buy/rebuy, this would be a call, because there's no additional value in buying into the 'tournament' that begins with hour 2 compared with any other $X tournament.

But the fact that there are a lot of chips in play that were bought at a lower chip/$ rate means there's a slight edge.

What's reasonable, like 3:1 regular buyin:addon? So say 300 buyins, 100 addons, you're buying 2k chips for $X, there are 650k chips in play, and the total value of the chips is 400X, so you get 2k chips for the cost of 1.65K, so the value of survival is ~350 chips.

Obviously it's higher for someone with an edge, so maybe ~500 chips, but I'm not sure if accounting for that makes sense, since you can buy into any tournament with that $X and the same relative edge. Regardless, your edge on a called shove is probably ~80% of your chip count plus some extra for the blinds; threeway pots and stealing the blinds make some difference but probably not much. So 400-600 sounds like the borderline.

In practice, it's close enough that I'd probably just stick it in if I had enough to raise.

[LearnedfromTV]

Also I think the possibility that you get isolated when you have like 150-250 chips is worth something. You'll often triple/quad+ up without having to fade three or four hands, at least past the flop.

[jaroot]

Call and hope someone cracks em so you can double rebuy and add on [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Errr wooops I didn't read the 1R + 1A part. I just call with no intention of adding on even if I quintuple up.

[kutuz_off]

[ QUOTE ]
If you got the same number of chips for an addon as the initial buy/rebuy, this would be a call, because there's no additional value in buying into the 'tournament' that begins with hour 2 compared with any other $X tournament.


[/ QUOTE ]

Is utility of chip per dollar of 2000 chips when blinds are 75-150 much higher than that of 1500 chips for the same price when blinds are 10-20? Is the difference high enough to want to forgo huge +cEV of AA?

I don't know the answer with 100, but I certainly push with 200.