QJs multiway

Riku · #1 01-31-2007, 03:32 PM

Villains is unkown.

These kind of hands come quite often. You call one bet on the BigBlind in a raised pot and hit top pair. But you could be dominated.

PokerStars 0.05/0.10 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. UTG posts a blind of $0.05.
UTG (poster) checks, UTG+1 raises, 1 fold, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, 2 folds, Button calls, SB calls, Hero calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (14 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG folds, UTG+1 raises, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Button folds, SB calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (12 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, SB calls, Hero calls.

River: (17 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, SB folds, Hero...

milesdyson · #2 01-31-2007, 03:37 PM

When I see this flop with that hand I actually hope it just gets checked around and then I can make my decision on the turn with only one card to come. Since that is what I hope for, I would do all I could to encourage it, so I would make the first play a check. I don't want many bets going in on the flop.

3-bet preflop FTW. And fold the river.

Jaran · #3 01-31-2007, 03:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
When I see this flop with that hand I actually hope it just gets checked around and then I can make my decision on the turn with only one card to come. Since that is what I hope for, I would do all I could to encourage it, so I would make the first play a check. I don't want many bets going in on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just to go a little further, what did you hope to accomplish with your flop bet? I feel it would be helpful for you to type out your reasoning here.

[ QUOTE ]
3-bet preflop FTW. And fold the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

Love this.

-Jaran

Riku · #4 01-31-2007, 03:54 PM

Thanks guys :-)

The flop bet. I think my reasoning at the time was that if i had the best hand, i want everyone to pay me. Of course they´re right to call with pretty much everything, though, and quite a few turn cards can ruin my hand.

Im not very strong with these kind of situations. But hopefully i´ll improve :-)

Jaran · #5 01-31-2007, 04:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks guys :-)

The flop bet. I think my reasoning at the time was that if i had the best hand, i want everyone to pay me. Of course they´re right to call with pretty much everything, though, and quite a few turn cards can ruin my hand.

Im not very strong with these kind of situations. But hopefully i´ll improve :-)

[/ QUOTE ]

Why do you think you might have the best hand? If you thought this, why not trey the flop? (I'm not advocating this, but you should know why or why not) Even though UTG+1 is unknown, what kind of range of hands are you giving him? How do you fare against this range?

-Jaran

Big Folder · #6 01-31-2007, 04:10 PM

i dont think this is a good spot to donk the flop. Were you hoping UTG would raise it up to protect? there has been some dicussion about ho this is incorrect unless you expect them to raise weak hands. In this case you are basically hoping he has somehting like AK-kqo and is raising with his flush draw+overcards.

You could be behind a lot of hands and if not there are overcards or any diamond that might kill your hand.

I think checking and calling might be ok here. betting into the raiser can't be right, either he calls and so does everyone in a huge pot where you are vulnerable. Or he raises with a hand htat likely has you beat or will have you beat by the river.

tyler_cracker · #7 01-31-2007, 04:11 PM

check-and-see the flop. donking here really sucks.

miles: you think QJs is strong enough to raise here even without the benefits of position/possible free turn card? how about JTs? 98s?

Riku · #8 01-31-2007, 04:14 PM

I thought i might have it, if he missed. His range, TT-AA, ATs+, AT+, KQs and maybe KQ. Im behind to JJ, KK, QQ, AA, AJs and AJ.

I didn´t 3bet pf, cuz it didn´t occur to me that i have a great multiway hand, and that maybe i should 3bet.

Riku · #9 01-31-2007, 04:24 PM

So, to sum things up. We check, because our hand is quite vulnerable. We´d rather wait and see how it holds up before investing anymore bets. We also want to see what UTG1 does.

Big Folder · #10 01-31-2007, 04:35 PM

[ QUOTE ]
So, to sum things up. We check, because our hand is quite vulnerable. We´d rather wait and see how it holds up before investing anymore bets. We also want to see what UTG1 does.

[/ QUOTE ]

We mainly do this to see what UTG does and the field's reaction to it. We are last as far as relative position goes (our relation to the likely bettor) so we'll be able to see what he does and how people behind him react.

For instance if he bets and some passive guy raises, you can probably get away from the hand.

If he bets and everyone calls, i'd call and reevaluate on the turn. If a safe card hits then you can start mixing it up in this large pot.