Bankroll/variance related question

[AceofSpades]

If a decent winning player was going to start playing at $50 or $100 PL and not withdraw any winnings until making a full bankroll 30~40 buyins

how much seed money would you figure reasonable to start off with?

[CrushinFelt]

Full ring? 5 buy-ins and nut peddle at those stakes

6-max? 8-10 buy-ins

[cmyr]

I would want at least 20 buyins for either full ring or SH, and I wouldn't feel particularly comfortable about it.

[CrushinFelt]

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I would want at least 20 buyins for either full ring or SH, and I wouldn't feel particularly comfortable about it.

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Yes there is a high variance, but I don't think those requirements are necessary at PLO 50 or 100. If you're playing so loose that you're going +- that many buy ins then you're not playing properly at those levels (for full ring especially and 6max I mostly have experience at 1/2 so I can't really say).

This is the second time now I've deposited 3 buyins, and in 3.5 sessions I'm up about 11 buy-ins (I say .5 because one of those sessions I was hammered). I have been down about 4 buyins across three tables at one point but I won it all back and then some.

Until you get above PLO50 and 100 you shouldn't be playing overly aggressive because you will lose your mind.

[Troll_Inc]

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If a decent winning player was going to start playing at $50 or $100 PL and not withdraw any winnings until making a full bankroll 30~40 buyins

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This is dependent on:
1. Your winrate
2. How sure you are about your winrate
3. Your style of play
4. The types of tables you choose

As people have pointed out before, look at your winrate to standard deviation ratio. Some basic calculations will tell you your risk of ruin (ROR) at different bankrolls.

Also, if you have data for different levels, you can choose the cutoff bankroll amount for each level.

If you are just starting out and have none of the above, probably your best goal is to play winning PLO for 1,000 then 5,000 then 10,000 hands with constant analysis. Until then, just buyin for an amount you can lose.

[TheRempel]

[ QUOTE ]
This is the second time now I've deposited 3 buyins, and in 3.5 sessions I'm up about 11 buy-ins (I say .5 because one of those sessions I was hammered). I have been down about 4 buyins across three tables at one point but I won it all back and then some.

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Man you are smoking some crack. You have been very lucky to run that well on such a tiny bankroll, but your risk of ruin is going to be close to 80% even with a high WR and a relatively low SD.

[iggymcfly]

Didn't want to make another thread for the same general topic, but let's say I have 30 buy-ins for 5/10 PLO. Can someone give me a conversion for about how many BB would carry the same amount of risk in LHE?

I've mainly just been taking shots at this level up until now, but I'd like to get an idea for how risky it is to continue here. Is it like playing LHE with 300 BB? 200 BB? 400 BB? Just trying to get an idea of the risk involved to see how soon I'd want to move down if things go bad.

[Troll_Inc]

[ QUOTE ]
Didn't want to make another thread for the same general topic, but let's say I have 30 buy-ins for 5/10 PLO. Can someone give me a conversion for about how many BB would carry the same amount of risk in LHE?

I've mainly just been taking shots at this level up until now, but I'd like to get an idea for how risky it is to continue here. Is it like playing LHE with 300 BB? 200 BB? 400 BB? Just trying to get an idea of the risk involved to see how soon I'd want to move down if things go bad.

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This really is completely dependent on your winrate and standard deviation at each level. Anyone read the Chen/Ankeman poker math book? There is a good treatment of this issue, and they point out that people probably don't move up quickly enough.

I don't know how to type out the math formulas, but I ran my own numbers comparing my stats at 10/25cent PLO vs $1/$2 PLO. If my bankroll is above $1200, I should play the $1/$2 PLO game, below that I should play the 10/25 cent game. This is grossly different from the general advice you get of you need "x" buyins at each level.

The caveat here is that my numbers would have to be absolutely true. I'm sure they are not, because I have much fewer hands at 1/2 and that number probably doesn't reflect my true (win)rate. And game conditions and my strategy employed could change such that the 25/50 cent and 50c/$1 games are more profitable to play for me than the 10c/25c game.

Since things can change quickly, you could reanalyze this at frequent time points to make sure you are playing your optimum game as conditions and your bankroll will change. One good thing is that there is a nice correction built into your actual data and analysis. If my bankroll gets to $1600 and I drop 2 buyins, then not only will I need to drop down but also my bankroll-game cutoff will move, such that I may need $1600 now to play the $1/$2 game.

It's a pretty simple formula: (variance of game 1 minus variance of game 2) divided by (winrate of game 1 minus winrate of game 2. Divide that sum by 2 and you have your cutoff bankroll for those two games. Note: you have to make sure your winrates/stdevs-variances are in $'s not Big Blinds. PM me if that doesn't make sense and I can plug your numbers in for you.