The teutonic far-right

[wacki]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5349696.stm

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Final results in German regional polls show the far right has won seats in an eastern state and Chancellor Angela Merkel's party has performed poorly.

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How far right is "far-right". I'm curious if religion is starting to take over europe like it has in the US.

[adios]

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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5349696.stm

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Final results in German regional polls show the far right has won seats in an eastern state and Chancellor Angela Merkel's party has performed poorly.

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How far right is "far-right". I'm curious if religion is starting to take over europe like it has in the US.

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Hmmm......... Could have fooled me about religion taking over the US.

BTW when we're discussing "far right" and "far left" I think we should define the center first. For instance I've been characterized by a few here as far right. Of course that's true if we're looking at the likes of Ward Churchill as the center but if we're discussing Bill Clinton or Dubya that certainly isn't true FWIW.

[AJW]

With in Europe religion is far less enmeshed with politics then in the US. Large parts of Europe are mostly secular and the far right is not necessarily anti abortion or pro prayer in schools.
I’m not familiar with German politics but if the NPD is anything like the BNP then its anti immigration pro military but economically by American standards socialist.

[wacki]

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Hmmm......... Could have fooled me about religion taking over the US.

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The percentage of U.S. adults who accept evolution declined from 45 to 40 percent.

....

Of the other countries surveyed, only Turkey ranked lower, with about 25 percent of the population accepting evolution and 75 percent rejecting it. In Iceland, Denmark, Sweden and France, 80 percent or more of adults accepted evolution; in Japan, 78 percent of adults did.

http://www.livescience.com/humanbiol..._evo_rank.html

You were saying? Although I will admit it's more of a combination of religion and industry that is performing it's assault on science. However, the statistics on evolution are very telling.

Bush has systematically replaced mainstream scientists w/ religious fundamentalists that happen to have Ph.D's and industry lawyers in countless key scientific posts. There are positions that were normally untouched by politics. Now they are being staffed by industry lawyers and religious leaders. A lot of these people literally use divine intervention as justification of their policy. The FDA's politically appointed David Hagar is just one of many examples. He wrote a book called "As jesus cared for Women". It advises women to cure PMS with prayer. he says "Even with divine intervention, the healing process may take a long time".

http://www.amazon.com/As-Jesus-Cared.../dp/0800717511

This is the guy that is the primary advisor to the president on contraception. He isn't alone. There are many like him in the white house. In fact, they outnumber mainstream scientists by a wide margin. Climate change isn't the only science that has been edited and suppressed. Press reports and studies from the CDC and NIH regarding stem cells, condom effectiveness, sex education, breast cancer/abortion link, etc have been systematically edited and even removed from websites. Every time it's been to detriment of mainstream science. This has been very well documented by the New York Times, Washington Post, Union of Concerned Scientists and countless other entities.

An Epidemic of Politics
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/conten...y/299/5607/625

Restoring Scientific Integrity in Policymaking - Petition signed by thousands of scientists
http://www.ucsusa.org/scientific_int...statement.html

I can easily find you hundreds of extra sources on this topic. Heck, I have 1,000+ sources sitting in front of me.

But we are getting off topic. I'd much rather find out what is going on in germany.

[adios]

And this means that religion is taking over the U.S. ????
Puhleeze.

You've made a statement of fact that in reality is just your opinion. I don't care if you hold that opinion but let's not start your post with a seemingly factual statement that is certainly open to debate.

Regarding Germany. Where is the center?

Edit: IMO you need to elaborate on what you mean when you state that religion is taking over the U.S. at the very least. I'm being a nit because having a debate on at best a nebulous premise seems futile to me but I could be convinced otherwise. Believe it or not "taking over" means different things to different people.

[wacki]

EDITin response to your edit) Taking over may be too strong of a word. Lets just say a far increasing role to the point where studies/scientific evidence is being edited to support moral beliefs and gain political bonus points.


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And this means that religion is taking over the U.S. ????

Puhleeze.

You've made a statement of fact that in reality is just your opinion. I don't care if you hold that opinion but let's not start your post with a seemingly factual statement that is certainly open to debate.

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When it comes to believing in evolution, the United states is at the bottom of the barrel. That is a fact. How is that not proof that religion is trumping science?

When it comes to key positions in the CDC, NIH, FDA, etc scientists are being replaced with religious fundamentalists that believe in faith healing, divine intervention, etc. That is a fact. It is also a fact that these positions have traditionally been immune to politicization. It is also a fact that scientific evidence is being edited to support causes promoted by religious leaders against the will of the very people that performed the studies. It is also a fact that this is occuring at a fequency higher now than any time since the dawn of the EPA. How is that not proof that religion is trumping science?

Does religion control this country? That is an opinion. But I don't see how it's possible for anyone to argue it's not taking an increasing roll in the US. And I don't see how it's possible for anyone to argue that religion has less of a role in the US than countries that score in the 80% (2x the US score) on evolution.

I'm not saying religion is bad. I'm simply saying that religion is playing a more dominant role in politics.

[Mickey Brausch]

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BBC Final results in German regional polls show the far right has won seats in an eastern state and Chancellor Angela Merkel's party has performed poorly.

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How far right is "far-right"?

[/ QUOTE ]In Germany, the two major parties, the Christian Democrats and the Social Democrats, are the center [1]. One is slightly more to the right (more family values, more pro-business, more law-and-order, less immigration-tolerant, etc) and the other slightly more to the left (more liberal in educational matters, more pro-environment, more pro-labor, more immigration-tolerant, etc). Emphasis please on the "slightly".

Both parties are unquestionigly pro-Israel, staunch Atlantists (i.e. pro-NATO) and have now become almost equally pro-American. (During the Vietnam war, they were much more apart.) You have not heard yet Merkel praising the American folly in Iraq, have you? That's what I mean by "equally"...

The new groups of the Extreme Right in Germany got a new lease of life after the incorporation of Eastern Germany. The massive unemployment that resulted from the disappearance of almost all state firms in the East, caused a huge resentment among many young people towards both traditional capitalist values (seen as bourgeois) and the "dirty foreigners who ..took away our jobs". The recruiters for bigotry had a field day in former DDR.

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I'm curious if religion is starting to take over Europe like it has in the US.

[/ QUOTE ]Never happen.

Why would you say that?

The small (re-)emergence of Extreme Right parties has nothing to do with Christianity. And it's got everything to do with the massive influx of immigrants.

Only last week, Sweden had what was for all practical purposes a change of regime: The Social Democrats who ruled Sweden for like 80 of the past 90 years or something, lost (narrowly) the general election. And one of the major electoral issues was immigration.

Mickey Brausch

[1] Kinda like the two American major parties, with the difference that in America the whole spectrum is placed more rightwards compared to Europe. (Or Europe is more leftward than the U.S. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img])

[steve9789]

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EDITin response to your edit) Taking over may be too strong of a word. Lets just say a far increasing role to the point where studies/scientific evidence is being edited to support moral beliefs and gain political bonus points.


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And this means that religion is taking over the U.S. ????

Puhleeze.

You've made a statement of fact that in reality is just your opinion. I don't care if you hold that opinion but let's not start your post with a seemingly factual statement that is certainly open to debate.

[/ QUOTE ]

When it comes to believing in evolution, the United states is at the bottom of the barrel. That is a fact. How is that not proof that religion is trumping science?

When it comes to key positions in the CDC, NIH, FDA, etc scientists are being replaced with religious fundamentalists that believe in faith healing, divine intervention, etc. That is a fact. It is also a fact that these positions have traditionally been immune to politicization. It is also a fact that scientific evidence is being edited to support causes promoted by religious leaders against the will of the very people that performed the studies. It is also a fact that this is occuring at a fequency higher now than any time since the dawn of the EPA. How is that not proof that religion is trumping science?

Does religion control this country? That is an opinion. But I don't see how it's possible for anyone to argue it's not taking an increasing roll in the US. And I don't see how it's possible for anyone to argue that religion has less of a role in the US than countries that score in the 80% (2x the US score) on evolution.

I'm not saying religion is bad. I'm simply saying that religion is playing a more dominant role in politics.

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Who are some of the scientists that believe in faith healing and divine intervention?

[lehighguy]

In my part of the country it seems like fewer people believe in God everyday. I only know a single person that goes to church, and he doesn't talk about religion at all outside of Church.

[Propertarian]

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How far right is "far-right".

[/ QUOTE ] The party's small base probably could be described as Neo-Nazi: the four most important things to them are Nationalism, anti-immigration, law and order, and strict punishment. At least two prominent leaders are openly neo nazis.

Their platform is not openly religous.

Most of the votes they are picking up are due to their extremist anti-immigration policy, however, and that is the issue that they talk about the most.