Top set on a draw heavy board. OOP, deep stacks, Multiway.

BriMc · #1 08-28-2006, 11:52 AM

This is from the 5/5 Live game I play in regularly.

400bb effective stacks, I cover.
PF: I open, 20 to go from ep with KKxx single suited, 7 people call.

Flop (~140)

KcJc4h

I lead for pot, MP re-pots, button calls (almost AI, has maybe 200 left in his stack)

So the MP has about 1500 left in his stack. He's a tight/solid player, the only possible hands he can have are a set of jacks, set + FD or the disaster wrap+FD, he never makes this play with just 1 draw. The button calling likely means a draw, but as a looser player with a shorter stack I can see him doing it with just the wrap or NFD. Its a wierd play to just call and leave 200 in his stack, but he does unorthadox things like this all the time.

If I shove here, I'm basically announcing I have top set to MP and leting him get away fairly easy if he's got a naked set of Jacks.

If they both have draws, I can possibly beneift from them blocking each other, but can I count on this enough to just smooth call?

CallYNotRaise06 · #2 08-28-2006, 12:53 PM

i call wouldnt be bad here if you can accurately put the tight player on ONLY JJxx. if so, id go ahead and call and bet the turn.

but,i would probably get it in right here because 1) youve got the absolute nuts right now, and 2) there are just too many turn cards you dont want to see. any club, A,Q,T,9, maby even a J might kill you. thats 22 cards. almost half of the remaining cards will hurt your hand.

you might be flipping a coin for a 5 or 6k pot, but that happens alot in omaha.

Yads · #3 08-28-2006, 01:02 PM

I think being out of position you need to repot this. This is why being out of position is a disadvantage. You often have to give up value so that players can't use their positional advantage against you.

bugstud · #4 08-28-2006, 02:17 PM

presuming you jam a big draw here too, you really should jam.

BriMc · #5 08-28-2006, 02:35 PM

good point. I'm always going to jam with AJ10c here.

a few more responses and I'll give results.

Voj · #6 08-28-2006, 07:19 PM

OOP ? Rerepot ... At worst it's a coin flip. If he hold jacks, at worst he'll fold 'em and you'll be against a bad draw with a lot of dead money in it. At best, if he can put you on a strong draw he'll call. So I don't see what better you could fancy OOP.

BriMc · #7 08-29-2006, 09:52 AM

Yeah...so I repotted, MP folded jacks, turn and river bricked, MHIG.

Everyone here confirmed my standard line, so I guess I was just being results oriented posting this, hoping someone would have a decent reason to smooth call the raise looking to get more out of a set over set situation like I had. But like everyone said, oop there's just no way around sacrificing some value here.