Bluffing and Semi-Bluffing... Trial and Error...

[Mossberg]

Both of these hands are taken from a very bad session where I'm worried I may have got out of a line in a few spots. Here's a couple...

No reads on villain, new to table, seems to be a little on the passive side post-flop though.

Limit: $3/$6
4 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (4 players) Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">SB raises</font>, Hero calls.

Flop: 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3SB, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2.5BB, 2 players)
SB checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets</font>, SB calls.

River: J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4.5BB, 2 players)
SB checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets</font> <font color="blue">I planned on just firing one on the turn and checking behind on the river if things didn't work out.. Then that river card just gave me a reason to fire again </font>

In this next one, Villain is 35/12/1.5 and I hate his guts. He's outplayed me and donked me out of pots that should have been mine. How is the C/R on the turn? Maybe I'm watching too many stox videos - I see him raise and c/r alot of flopped flush draws (on the turn), but I think you generally want a tight opponent who is capable of folding decent holdings in order to semi-bluff here. And although I should have given up on the river, I thought I miiight be able to get him to throw his hand away if I fire again.

Limit: $3/$6
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
UTG calls, 4 folds, 4 folds, Hero checks.

Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2.33SB, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">UTG bets</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2.17BB, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">UTG bets</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises</font>, UTG calls.

River: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6.17BB, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">Hero bets</font>....

[econophile]

hand 1, the pot is too small and your hand is to good to bet river. why no 3-bet preflop?

hand 2, check/raise the flop! what are you folding on the river?

[kapw7]

Hand 1.
The river bet is just awful. Big mistake that you need to avoid. You have no reads and the 90%+ of on line players will never fold A-hi (or better) here. Also either raise preflop or raise the flop. You have position and a good hand.

Hand 2
The turn c-r is fine. Again the river bet is bad. You might make some money from a K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]x hand but you won't make any better hands to fold. Bluff bet river with 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]x or something like that but not with Ax.

[Caddy_4_Life]

Hand 1: It looks like Villain outplayed you with Ace high. I would do the same.

Hand 2: I prefer betting the flop or check/raising it.

-Caddy

[Mossberg]

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: It looks like Villain outplayed you with Ace high. I would do the same.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you mean you would play it the same as I did?

[Caddy_4_Life]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: It looks like Villain outplayed you with Ace high. I would do the same.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you mean you would play it the same as I did?

[/ QUOTE ]

No. If I was Villain I would play ace high the same. It got +2BB more out of you then him betting the turn and you folding. It also stops you from semi-bluffing.

Now, if I was you, I would bet the turn when he checked to you but I would certainly not throwin a bet on the river. You beat nothing he calls with and your not going to get a better hand to fold.

-Caddy

[kapw7]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: It looks like Villain outplayed you with Ace high. I would do the same.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you mean you would play it the same as I did?

[/ QUOTE ]

No. If I was Villain I would play ace high the same. It got +2BB more out of you then him betting the turn and you folding. It also stops you from semi-bluffing.



[/ QUOTE ]

That's a losing play with A-hi. Callling a turn and river bet on a board like that and a small pot.

[Caddy_4_Life]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: It looks like Villain outplayed you with Ace high. I would do the same.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you mean you would play it the same as I did?

[/ QUOTE ]

No. If I was Villain I would play ace high the same. It got +2BB more out of you then him betting the turn and you folding. It also stops you from semi-bluffing.



[/ QUOTE ]

That's a losing play with A-hi. Callling a turn and river bet on a board like that and a small pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

Against players who bet everytime when checked too (this would accompany a read) this is a winning play for me and it's indisputable.

-Caddy

[Nick C]

Hand 1: The river card gives you more to represent, but it's not really such a great card for you. Villain's turn call in this small pot suggests he has a draw or is calling down. You don't beat anything he's calling down with, and some draws just improved. So you're kind of hoping he has A6o or A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] or 66 and will fold it.

And he will fold, occasionally (though I doubt he'll fold a pair very often). But I think, instead of bluffing, I'd just check behind and lose. (And you will lose. There's hardly anything you beat here.)

Hand 2: A problem you have here is that the board hits a slightly loose-passive player's UTG open-limping zone fairly well, and that becomes more true when the turn and river cards fall. And also his follow-up bet on the turn increases the chances that he really has something (instead of just air).

Probably I would just lead or checkraise the flop and go from there.

On the river, I don't like any of your options. I'd probably start with a check, though. And I think check-folding is probably best. Your hand won't be good very often, and the turn checkraise should discourage a river bluff from a completely busted draw (and it's hard to find a whole lot of those, actually).

[PokerSparky]

Hand 1: IMO, to make plays at players at this level you need to have a very strong read. Without one, I just play straight forward poker. The pot is so small on the river, I don't see any value in bluffing.

Hand 2: I prefer leading the flop and turn in these situations. It sounds like you were tilting against this villain. Betting the river doesn't do much besides fold hands you were already ahead of IMO.