LC: shots at bigger games during the WSOP? (long, rambling)

[tyler_cracker]

This may be the wrong forum for this, but [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] micros. Also, those B&M guys are [censored] anyway.

I live in Vegas. I am primarily a live player, currently donking around in 4/8 with a bankroll of $2k.

It is World Series time here, which means there is a lot of action in town (i haven't really noticed this yet, but based on anecdotal evidence, i'm sure it is the case).

I've been talking with a fellow 2+2er (STT hero Slim Pickens) about taking advantage of the extra action. Long story short, he is willing to buy whatever % of my action i am willing to sell, and has given me $1k to use as i please (giving him an appropriate cut of the profits).

The Question: what should i do?

I'm thinking this is a good time/opportunity to take a shot at some bigger games: Caesars/Venetian 6/12, Bellagio/Wynn 8/16, Mirage 10/20.

This question isn't so much about staking specifics (how much of my action to sell at any given level) -- though this is an important consideration. The real question, i guess, is about the value -- both EV and to my growth as a player -- of playing bigger while the games should be good and while i've got some extra BR insulation.


Here's some random extra information about me.

Here are my live stats:

level...total...big bets.....bb/hr..........total hrs

2/4 | 621.00 | 155.250000 | 0.6197604790 | 250.50

3/6 | 2538.00 | 423.000000 | 1.1066056246 | 382.25

4/8 | 1217.50 | 152.187500 | 0.6901927435 | 220.50

----------------------------------------------------
TOTAL | 4099.50 | 683.250000 | 0.8107848808 | 864.25

(the total is slightly different than the sum of the above rows, because there are a few other levels/games in there that i was too lazy to remove. 2/4-3/6-4/8 comprises the vast majority of my play, though.)

And while we're at it, my online stats:



I've been working on playing online more, which was a struggle at first because i started off as a live player and live play is more fun. But as i have learned more, the many many benefits of online play have forced me to reconsider my approach.

Also implicit in all this is the matter of confidence. Like most (all?) poker players, my confidence waxes and wanes, but in spite of my lackluster stats, i am convinced that i understand the game well enough to win at all the levels i have played. Furthermore, i believe that these games i'm looking to take shots at aren't really any more challenging than the games i play now.

So, um, comments anyone?

[Aaron W.]

When I was in Vegas back in April, the Mirage 10/20 game was already soft. If it's softer, you can probably pull a decent 1.5 BB/hour playing a mediocre game.

But really, you should be thinking small NL tables, because that's probably where all the money is probably going.

[bennyhana]

Do you play poker for a living? I thought you had played more online hands than that.

Why not try taking a shot online to get a little used to the larger dollar ammount swings and see how your confidence is. You might be suprized how much better you play.

[tyler_cracker]

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But really, you should be thinking small NL tables, because that's probably where all the money is probably going.

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I agree completely, and i've started playing a little $25 NL to this end.

What i have learned is that i have no idea how to play NL. I'm working on it though.

[tyler_cracker]

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Do you play poker for a living?

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Short answer: no.

Medium answer: i do not currently rely on poker for any living expenses, though i will probably need to take some money out of the bankroll for a few expenses over the summer. My bankroll also isn't really replaceable.

Long answer: as long as i've started the most self-indulgent thread ever, i'll include some more details below for the morbidly curious.

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I thought you had played more online hands than that.

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I fake competence pretty good, eh? [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

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Why not try taking a shot online to get a little used to the larger dollar ammount swings and see how your confidence is. You might be suprized how much better you play.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think i do a reasonable job of thinking of my stack in terms of BBs rather than $$.

Since my normal game (4/8) is bigger than anything i can reasonably stab at online (5/10 is a scary beast; much scarier than a live 10/20 game), i'm not sure what i would gain by this approach. Maybe i'm not understanding you? Cuz i don't understand what you're getting at with the last sentence?



Ok, here's the long answer about my work/life/poker situation.

I dropped out of the tech industry in December of 2004 because i worked for a [censored] company and hated my job. I had a bunch of money in savings (since i was making pretty good money at the [censored] company, and since i'm a cheap, cheap bastard in virtually all aspects of my life), so i spent the winter skiing in Tahoe (Kirkwood 4ever, bitches).

During this time, i got serious about recreational poker. I studied WLLH and SSH and played a lot of 3/6 at Harvey's.

When my lease ran out in May 2005, poker was the only thing i was particularly interested in. I was ready for a change of scenery anyway, so i decided to just move to Vegas and see what happened. I quickly realized i don't have the temperament to grind out a living at 4/8, but i stumbled into a job teaching chess to elementary school kids.

The job is fun, affords me a lot of free time, and covers the bills (though not by much). Thus, i describe myself as a semi-professional poker player, because during hard times, i cover expenses from the bankroll. Mostly, lately, i've been able to reinvest my winnings back into the bankroll, which is why i'm sitting here now contemplating taking shots at some bigger games, with an eye towards being able to afford moving up.

And there's more than you ever wanted to know about me. Word.

[bennyhana]

You didn't, like, wear your Teva's with socks to the ski resorts, did you? [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

I haven't played live in a casino. So I guess I can't comment on that at all. Only from what I "hear".

I just know when I take a shot above my BR, I usually play much better, and learn something new. I just thought you could benefit from playing in a more aggressive game, if that is what you are worried about.

I don't see any reason why you shouldn't take some shots when the games are good. (like now) You obviously have a good grasp of the game. I've never played with you, to my knowledge, but you seem to know what you are doing.

Go for it man!!

[Aaron W.]

[ QUOTE ]
Since my normal game (4/8) is bigger than anything i can reasonably stab at online (5/10 is a scary beast; much scarier than a live 10/20 game), i'm not sure what i would gain by this approach. Maybe i'm not understanding you? Cuz i don't understand what you're getting at with the last sentence?

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. Go play live 10/20 because live is much much much softer than online. You'll learn that the game is better than you thought possible and you'll pad your bankroll if you want to do some real poker development by moving up in the online game. You'll also get comfortable with the cash fluctuations of larger losses (and hopefully even larger wins).

[tyler_cracker]

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You didn't, like, wear your Teva's with socks to the ski resorts, did you? [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

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I wear Tevas With Socks *everywhere*. The beauty of the TwS is that you *can* wear them in the snow. On cold days, i have a pair of Ugg boots (just when you thought i couldn't get any sexier).

I do not wear socks with Uggs.

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I just know when I take a shot above my BR, I usually play much better, and learn something new.

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Good point.

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I just thought you could benefit from playing in a more aggressive game, if that is what you are worried about.

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I'm not really sure what i'm worried about, except, of course, FAILURE.

[bennyhana]

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I do not wear socks with Uggs.


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My daughter does this and the smell is horrendous. I'm talking worse than dirty jock straps late into the football season. I wont let her take them off in the car.

[HouseCalls]

Tyler -

I'm gonna be in Vegas in September for a meeting. I donked around the 2/4 games last time I was in town because I pretty much sucked. I think I'm ready to get in 3/6 and maybe 4/8 games this go round but knowing how bad the rake is in the low limit games (and having been somewhat inspired by Aaron's 10/20 trip to the Mirage a few months ago) I am toying with an idea that might work for you.

Since you live in Vegas and have access to all the games with no time limit (like the 5 day window I'll be on) why not do a B&M 15BB challenge or some variation there of? It will get you a look at the bigger games without much risk.

Take Care - House