Fun w/ 86s

[The Dude]

Here's a hand from two nights ago.

Bellagio 30-60. Button in this hand is Gonores, BB is loose and passive preflop, weak postflop.

Preflop:
Folded to The Dude in the CO who raises 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Gonores 3bets, SB folds, BB calls, The Dude calls.

Flop: (9.67 SBs) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
Checked to Gonores who bets, BB calls, The Dude calls.

Turn: (6.33 BBs) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
BB checks, what's The Dude's plan for the hand? What rivers change that plan?

[mongidig]

I think raising with 8s6s is a little too loose here. This is especially true if the button is Aggressive and the blinds are loose and showdown bound. I would raise with this on the button against tight blinds.

I think I would donk the turn unless the button is aggressive and you know he would bet again. However, if you think he would raise you then betting is better allowing you to three bet and protect your hand.

[goofball]

Doug can be counted on to bet more often than most. Check-raise here, fold if the BB check-raises. If Doug 3bets I'd call and check-call the river unless it counterfeited me (or a draw gets there and BB checkraises doug).

So many things on the river depend on what happened on the turn.

[threeonefour]

turn is a very obvious check raise in my opinion. then bet the river obv.

basically nothing interesting about this hand unless, like others have considered, the BB check raises himself or you get three bet or raised on the river or something similar.

so i guess what i am saying is, reveal more of the action plz. i know you are asking for 'a plan' but to get more specific than what i have already laid out you need to consider a ton of permutations of bet/raise/call/fold lines from BB and gonores and then evaluate each permutation if an A hits the river, a K hits the river, a 7 hits the river, a blank hits the river etc... which is going to be a waste of time for the most part

[cmcxchris]

Interesting hand.

I prefer to 4-bet/cap pre-flop. Is that in your range?

I like betting the turn. Checking followed by a button check can lead to a lot of bad things.

Bet the turn. Hope somebody raises you, and you can 3-bet.

Bet/raise most rivers. I need to think about it a little more.

[ssmallz]

I like betting here too, Doug can be 3 bettting w/a wide range of hands and betting the flop with almost all of them. There's justtoo great a chance that doug will check behind hoping to take a freebe w/a hand like QT, or Ax. While I realize none of these hands really concern you, losing out on value on the turn against a LP whose calling w/all sorts of bs is too great to give up.

[esspo]

Bet. A tough player will think the donk smacks of weakness so he is much more likely to raise you when he's behind allowing you to 3-town.

[rafiki]

"What rivers change that plan? "

obviously A's and counterfeit cards.

[brick]

check if gonores is playing his the overly agro style that he like to play. if he's going to be a ton of very weak hands like AQ, AJ, AT, QT, QJs, 55-77 then you should check-raise.
If he is playing more reasonably then I like a donk because he will often check if he has nothing, or he will have a good piece (Exceptions beent QQ-TT and A9s). So I see him raising with a good chunk and then you can 3-bet.

I guess getting 4-bet sucks but hopefully that won't happen often.
p.s. probably better to fold preflop

[mosch]

I don't know gonores, but I bet with the dream of going to 3-bet-ville and then leading the river.

As for what cards change my plan, much of this depends on how gonores plays and in particular, how likely he is to bluff-raise the river. If you could safely fold to a river-raise, then as far as I'm concerned no card is a scare card to me.

I completely disagree with goofball's suggestion to check-raise and fold to the blind's check-raise. In that case, I'd guess you're losing much of the time, but it'll still show a profit from the combined times that the blind flips over KQ/KJ/A9/TT/72o/etc. This is especially true if you and gonores are habitual blind stealers, which you probably are.