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#1
03-22-2007, 07:48 PM
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85s in BB, the book says fold, I would call
From Jacobs&Brier: How good is yout limit hold em: "$20-$40 game and an early player raises and is called by the button and the small blind. Our hero is sitting in the big blind with some piece of junk like 8c5c. He can see $140 and 7-1 pot odds" "Calls such as these are a foolproof strategy for allowing your funds to dribble away"
I would instacall that 85s in BB given the pot odds and implied odds. Is the book weak tight here or am I too loose? 
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#4
03-22-2007, 08:05 PM
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Re: 85s in BB, the book says fold, I would call
[ QUOTE ]
Easy call in that situation in my opinion. What justification do they give for folding? [/ QUOTE ] Probably that it was an EP raise, but I'd snapcall here.
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#5
03-22-2007, 08:08 PM
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Re: 85s in BB, the book says fold, I would call
The book is weak tight in this situation...sort of.
The book assumes that you may get into big trouble with this hand post flop and not know how to play it, nor how to determine where you stand in the hand post flop. Of hand you would not reraise pf here, any pp is playable as are suited gappers, and quite a few other hands. Theoretically, your hand only needs about 15% equity to be profitable here. Four way, I can't see too many ways where you don't have 15% equity. FWIW, since I started reading this forum about a year ago, it seems that much of the advice here is geared towards crushing guys that follow the by-the-book advice.
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#7
03-22-2007, 08:19 PM
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Re: 85s in BB, the book says fold, I would call
I'm only folding to the tightest raiser in the game.
With this hand does it really matter if it was an EP or LP raise? Either way we are behind their range, yes or no?
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#8
03-22-2007, 09:00 PM
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Why folding is correct.
your are not close to 7 to 1 to win. you make your flush about 6% of the time. flop 2 pair or better about 1 in 28. your expectation is clearly negative, fold.
sure you make flushes, full houses, end up with 2 pair that holds up and win sometimes, but overall it has a clear neg ev. if you had a suited connector giving you another way to win then it is an easy call. the authors are correct.
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#9
03-22-2007, 11:16 PM
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Re: 85s in BB, the book says fold, I would call
I think I would need one more caller in here. I don't think you are missing a ton of value here by folding. There is nothing wrong with folding 8-high from the BB here.
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#10
03-23-2007, 04:52 AM
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Re: 85s in BB, the book says fold, I would call
[ QUOTE ]
Quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Easy call in that situation in my opinion. What justification do they give for folding? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Probably that it was an EP raise, but I'd snapcall here. [/ QUOTE ] Doesn't the fact that it's an EP raise make the call better here? If I hit my hand, the EP raiser likely missed his, and if he has an EP raise sort of hand, he might not like to admit here that he is getting crushed by some crappy 85sooted hand, and he might contribute an extra bet or two before he realizes that he needs to slow down.
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