Viewing friends for their usefulness

luckyjimm · #1 09-03-2007, 10:29 AM

I had a big argument with an Italian friend last night. I had gone to her flat to rewrite one of her college essays, which required a lot of work. She had a big party the week before when we'd all done lots of drugs. I started a conversation about said drugs, and she got upset because she thought the neighbours could hear. I know from past experience she won't discuss drugs over the telephone or messenger. I thought she was quite rude in how she was telling me to pipe down, and I said remember I've come here to help you and have spent time and money to get here.

THAT really set her off, and she was attacking me for it for the rest of the evening. She said she was insulted and offended, because my being there to help her had nothing to do with the rules she had in her flat. And I had showed I wasn't a true friend by being begrudging about helping her. She said true friends do things for each other naturally, without thought and without complaint, and they weren't weighing up what was in it for them and what they could get back. She is part of a crowd of Italians that I know who are always helping each other out with accomodation, food, time, etc, and do it in a natural way, an expression of their fondness for each other - and also perhaps in the way immigrant communities traditionally take care of each other, which is for me quite alien and hard to adjust to, though I appreciate their kindness.

It made me realise that this doesn't come as naturally to me as I'd like. I am happy to help my friends, but probably at the same time I'm aware of what I can get in return. For example, there's another Italian guy I help with his essays who is severely dyslexic and his essays are incomprehensible, an absolute nightmare to fix. But a few years back he let me stay in his flat for two months when I had nowhere to live, and I stayed a few days with his family once when I was in Italy. So I help him, because he has helped me.

When you help your friends, are you wondering how they can also help you? Are you organically, naturally able to both help and accept help, without drawing attention to it, or do you sometimes find yourself weighing up your friends in terms of their usefulness? Is it possible to learn to help without looking like you're keeping accounts?

Billy Bibbit · #2 09-03-2007, 10:54 AM

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When you help your friends, are you wondering how they can also help you?

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Not really, but I'd definitely never go off on someone when they were in the middle of doing me a big favor. That's pretty [censored] of her.

kevin017 · #3 09-03-2007, 11:02 AM

its totally natural to judge how close you are to your friends in some fashion. looking at it purely from usefulness is just the most cold way of looking at it. but really, we are only ever friends with people because they are useful to us.

i would've told her that good friends aren't ungrateful. you're there helping her not because you expect cash or a favor in the future, but because she's someone you care about and you want her gratitude, and her being rude to you while at the same time expecting you to help her makes it feel like she's not really a friend but merely bitching you around.

luckyjimm · #4 09-03-2007, 11:18 AM

Her point was that even if I am there to help, she still has rules in her house and I can't break them just because I'm helping. And to draw attention to my helping her as an excuse for breaking her rules was, for her, out of order.

daryn · #5 09-03-2007, 11:26 AM

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Her point was that even if I am there to help, she still has rules in her house and I can't break them just because I'm helping. And to draw attention to my helping her as an excuse for breaking her rules was, for her, out of order.

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agree w/ her 100%

z28dreams · #6 09-03-2007, 11:29 AM

Sorry OP, you're out of line here.

It's one thing to break the rules if you didn't take your shoes off, or she let you eat in her living room, etc.

But you're talking out loud about her drug use. She clearly doesn't want people to know about this, and you're aware of this.

This is not an "even trade".

Suppose you have a friend come over that offers to help you do some yard work. While outside, he talks loudly about your impotence and the 3 girls next door overhear.

He should be allowed to keep talking about it because he's doing your yard work right?

Use some common sense.

Edited to add: I also find it idiotic that just talking about drugs is so enjoyable to you that you consider it part of your payback for helping her.

johnnylovescandy · #7 09-03-2007, 11:35 AM

she sounds like every eurobitch i've ever snorted with...

luckyjimm · #8 09-03-2007, 11:40 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry OP, you're out of line here.

It's one thing to break the rules if you didn't take your shoes off, or she let you eat in her living room, etc.

But you're talking out loud about her drug use. She clearly doesn't want people to know about this, and you're aware of this.

This is not an "even trade".

Suppose you have a friend come over that offers to help you do some yard work. While outside, he talks loudly about your impotence and the 3 girls next door overhear.

He should be allowed to keep talking about it because he's doing your yard work right?

Use some common sense.

Edited to add: I also find it idiotic that just talking about drugs is so enjoyable to you that you consider it part of your payback for helping her.

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It was the first time I'd seen her since the party. We were talking about the party and both agreed it was funny it finished about 5am, because normally the parties this crowd have go on much longer. I said I thought it was because there wasn't much coke about. What has happened in the past is when people come down from the MDMA about 4am they switch over to cocaine, and the party goes on past breakfast. She objected to my using the C word in case the neighbours overheard. I said, well, having a great big drug-fuelled party with DJs and people coming and going all night is rather more likely to tip off the neighbours than me talking!

I do take your point, though. It was just weird that it got into a whole debate about whether I was capable of friendship or was always expecting something in return, etc.

oddjob · #9 09-03-2007, 11:53 AM

yah, friends don't say stuff that obviously makes their friends uncomfortable, regardless of what you are doing.

friends also don't throw their help into their friends face as well.

so you trying to nail this girl?

pics please.

guids · #10 09-03-2007, 12:05 PM

If someone is shooting their mouth off about drug use in earshot of my neighbors, I dont care if it is 10 and Im in the middle of [censored] her, Im going to tell her to pipe down. There are certain things Id agree with the OP, certain things not. If the OP wanted to eat some chips, near teh computer, and she said no "becuase thats the rules" he is right, yelling about drug use is different.